I think Erik missed the most important purpose for transit. That is to move a large number of people from one place to another. To mover them from where they are to where they want to go. That is to work, to entertainment and to retail locations. Mass transit is to move a large number of people efficiently. To me this means without a lot of extra time spent trying to get from here to there. Using this philosophy and the roads and highways as an example, that means we need some sort of major throughway (the Interstate system); this would be connected with major spurs (the state and county highway system); then you have feeder lines (the various streets and avenues). Given this scenario and applying it statewide, I would argue we need a high speed rail limited stop, limited capacity system that originates in the four corners of the state and flows to the Twin Cities. We need a system from the major bedroom communities in both metros that flow through or meets in most appropriate Twin City. We would need a means to get from one bedroom community to its neighboring community without having to go into one of the Twin Cities. this might be express buses. Obviously, we need the system to serve major entertainment and retail properties. Why? Because that is where people want to go when they aren't at work. Of course, this would be cost prohibitive to do this all at once. Just like the current highway infrastructure would be cost prohibitive is we tried to do something like that today. But its just my opinion Mike Fratto Payne Phalen
>>> Erik Hare <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 08/13/2004 11:36:22 AM >>> I want to back up a moment and ask a very serious question about transit in general, one Charlie Swope asked earlier: What is it for? With all seriousness, I think many of us have a solution in search of a problem. Let me give you some ideas of what the actual concern is: The purpose of rail transit is: 1) To get people to work. 2) To get people to retail locations. 3) To get people to cultural attractions. Pick one, and only one. Why do I say "only one"? Because one of those is going to have to be paramount over the others when we make the decision as to where the rail line should go first. <vent> The one thing I really hate in the University Ave discussion is the number of times the official line comes out as "It'll stop often! It'll be fast! It won't take parking spaces! It'll be clean! It whitens teeth!" and so on. It cannot do all of those things for all people, even at the high price tag it's got. </vent> And the choice between jobs and retail is a rather stark one, because the highest concentration of jobs in Saint Paul is NOT Downtown, but is rather along the industrial corridor roughly defined by the BN trackage and 1 mile to either side. If you mean this thing to serve people going to and from work, speed and proximity to jobs will be important. That's the BN corridor. If you intend this to get people to retail outlets along University, you put it down the Avenue. You have to choose one or the other, and accept that as the paramount use of rail. The other use will not be served as well, by definition. So what is this thang for? Why do we want to build it in the first place? Erik Hare [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.comcast.net/~wabbitoid/ Irvine Park, West End, Saint Paul, Minnesota, USA, North America, Earth Fine Amish furniture, cedar chests, and crafts http://www.harmonycedar.com _____________________________________________ To Join: St. Paul Issues Forum Rules Discussion Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] _____________________________________________ NEW ADDRESS FOR LIST: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To subscribe, modify subscription, or get your password - visit: http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/stpaul Archive Address: http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/private/stpaul/ _____________________________________________ To Join: St. Paul Issues Forum Rules Discussion Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] _____________________________________________ NEW ADDRESS FOR LIST: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To subscribe, modify subscription, or get your password - visit: http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/stpaul Archive Address: http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/private/stpaul/
