Lets get real in this discussion. Everyone has made very salient points about the affect of neighborhood schools etc. But the real reason, IMHO, that kids don't spend a lot of time at rec centers etc is the proliferation of in-home entertainment. Why would you go to the playground and need to get involved with other people when you can sit at home and watch a screen where you can kill and maim with impunity? Another issue may be the presence of basketball hoops in outdoor play areas. There was a news story on KARE11, about the issues with playgrounds with BB hoops. West St. Paul removed hoops from a rec area due to the complaints it received about the various activities that went on in this park. See:. http://www.kare11.com/news/news_article.aspx?storyid=79678 What they found was once the hoops were removed, not only did the unwanted activity leave but the park use actually increased. I don't know how this plays with St. Paul parks. I do know that the parks my son plays at do not have BB hoops outdoors. Mike Fratto Payne Phalen
>>> "Bruce Leier" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 04/20/2005 11:34:30 AM >>> > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On > Behalf Of Dennis Tester > Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2005 09:24 AM > To: Tom Goldstein/Elysian Fields Quarterly; Tim Erickson; St. Paul Issues > Forum; Bob Treumann > Subject: Re: [StPaul] Booster Clubs > > > "I think we need neighborhood schools back, so that parents in the > neighborhood can work together to support their school, > and the future of their kids and neighbors kids." > > I guess it's up to the republican to state the obvious. What Bob and Tom > are longing for are the days before school bussing. When I was ten, we > moved from the Rondo neighborhood to the Selby-Dale neighborhood and I > enrolled at Webster elementary. My family was glad that now, instead of > walking 8 blocks to Maxfield, my siblings and I only had to walk 6 to > Webster! The kids I met there in the 4th grade became my after-school > playmates, since we all lived within a few blocks of each other. If > someplace was too far to walk, we biked over. > > We all went on to Marshall Jr. High together and our unsupervised play > graduated to sports (basketball, dodgeball, softball) at the Selby > community > center which was "staffed" by college kids from the U. Their "coaching" > involved bringing a bag of bats and balls out to the paved-over > playground, > where we played from dawn to dusk in the summer; or unlocking the gym and > throwing a dozen basketballs out onto the floor in the winter. There were > no coaches, there were no uniforms, there were no leagues. But most > importantly, there were no parents around. We learned the game from each > other, and every game was a pick-up game. Sometimes the community center > staff would organize games against kids from other community centers, like > Hallie Q Brown, Oxford, or the Salvation Army on 7th Street. They'd pass > out different colored jerseys so at least we knew who to pass the ball to. > > When we went on to high school, we STILL walked to school ... some went to > Central, I walked about 3 miles to Mechanic Arts (I don't know the > distance > for sure, I never thought about it so I never measured it) but we still > hung > out together after school. As high school athletes, we competed against > those kids that we had met from the other playgrounds, who were now > playing > for Monroe or Highland Park, or Central. I still see those "kids" today > and > our conversations have been known to include such things as the disputed > homerun someone hit in the 6th grade or the crush we had on a particular > girl in the 8th. > > It's been said by people from out of town that it's hard to make friends > here. I remember one quote in particular where a woman said "These people > have the same friends they had in Kindergarten, and they're not looking to > make new ones." I laughed when I read that because my wife's closest > friends today (who are now all grandmothers) are girls she met in > kindergarten at Cathedral School. > > So, if you relish that type of up-bringing, just remember, none of it > would > have happened if there had been school bussing. Neighborhood schools are > the glue that bind neighborhoods together, and the upbringing I enjoyed > will > never happen again [Leier says:] (tongue only partially in cheek) If you are the effect of "neighborhood schools" this is the best argument for magnets I've heard in years. because to eliminate bussing would inconvenience too > many > parents who would oppose it with the same phony arguments they used for > bussing in the first place ... desegregation. And the well-meaning > parents > who know the value of strong neighborhoods will be cowed and intimidated > into silence. Just like they were then. > > > Dennis Tester > Mac-Groveland > > Cleverly Arranging 1's And 0's Since 11110110000 [Leier says:] Seriously. This is much too simplistic. My children did not go to neighborhood schools in the twin cities beyond 2nd grade. They attended St. Paul Open School during the '80s and into the '90s. 3 of the 4 had and still have very close friends who were from the neighborhood. Those friends attended different schools. They made friends based on common interests, not just because they went to school together. It isn't "just integration" that caused the push for magnets - as you imply. Parent's today are more inclined to push an agenda on their children then our parent's and we were. We have become obsessed with specialization and dogma - that means magnets to meet those expectations. Bruce Leier Aurora/St. Anthony Grew up in Merriam Park > > ------------------------------------------------- > JOIN the St. Paul Issues Forum TODAY: > http://www.e-democracy.org/stpaul/ > ------------------------------------------------- > POST MESSAGES HERE: stpaul@mnforum.org > > To subscribe, modify subscription, or get your password - visit: > http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/stpaul > > Archive Address: > http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/private/stpaul/ ------------------------------------------------- JOIN the St. Paul Issues Forum TODAY: http://www.e-democracy.org/stpaul/ ------------------------------------------------- POST MESSAGES HERE: stpaul@mnforum.org To subscribe, modify subscription, or get your password - visit: http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/stpaul Archive Address: http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/private/stpaul/ ------------------------------------------------- JOIN the St. Paul Issues Forum TODAY: http://www.e-democracy.org/stpaul/ ------------------------------------------------- POST MESSAGES HERE: stpaul@mnforum.org To subscribe, modify subscription, or get your password - visit: http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/stpaul Archive Address: http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/private/stpaul/
