-----Original Message-----
From: arma...@uwm.edu [mailto:arma...@uwm.edu]
Sent: Thursday, 02 September, 2010 16:04
To: Stripes Users List
Subject: Re: [Stripes-users] Stripes Development and its Future... (this one
is long too)
While the project is mostly feature-complete, it feels difficult to write
extensions that are not hackish. For example, the URL
writing has never met my needs for my projects. The default
implementation is probably fine for most people but it incredibly
difficult to swap it out for something else. I mean, I certainly could
use a urlrewrite (and
have) but this is ridiculously tedious. I would like to write my own
implementation (act a little more like Rails routes) but don't
want to recreate the wheel (many methods and classes are private or
otherwise).
Andy,
Good point, I am experiencing the same problem. The Stripes URL binding
feature is nice, but it lacks the ability to map
any URL schema (unlike Spring MVC that could be rightfully defined our
closed competitor). This may be OK for developing
applications, but for building websites that need to be Search Engine
Friendly (all websites!) this can be a big show stopper.
(especially migrating legacy websites to Stripes, that need to implement
their old legacy URL schema).
And indeed, extensibility in general is important, as Stripes should not
bloat to a full stack but needs to rely on integrations of many stacks.
Regards,
Andy
Ross Sargant wrote:
I agree with the sentiment that the framework is basically feature
complete. I've been a happy user for 2+ years and for the size and
scale of projects I work on, I'd have to say I have no serious complaints
at all.
I've actually appreciated the fact that stripes is such a limited &
focussed framework and sticks to that. That saves me all the time I'd
normally have to spend learning the latest bells & whistles myself and
passing knowledge on to others on my team. It doesn't make any sense
for stripes to give that virtue up in the hope that the developer
activity & feature bloat associated with that will somehow attract more
users.
My experience with stripes has been that it makes the really tedious
stuff easy but it doesn't lay down so much that you can't freely apply
your own creativity where you want. I think that is ideal and if it
ain't broke, don't fix it.
So,it would seem to me that its the marketing side that needs more
urgent attention. If the level of activity on the mailing list is at
all indicative of the number of users then clearly there is an issue
but for every 1 person who decides not to use stripes due to its slow
release cycle, there could be 10 people who just don't know about it at
all.
I also agree that this is a very high quality mailing list. I
*suspect* that many on this mailing list hold more senior technical
positions in smaller organizations and used that position to introduce
stripes without having to justify it to a commission. That
"demographic" is probably the best chance for growth and the
philosophy behind stripes really works in that setting. A simple,
reliable thing that is easy to learn and helps you get things done. It
might not get you full buzzword points on your product brochure but you'll
definitely sleep well!
Unfortunately, I'm no marketer but I don't mind lending a hand where I
can :)
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 9:40 PM, Freddy Daoud <xf2...@fastmail.fm
<mailto:xf2...@fastmail.fm>> wrote:
Hi all,
I have been thinking about this topic for quite some time now and,
admittedly, have been "avoiding" it.. but now that the discussion has
been sparked, I can't hide my head in the sand anymore.
I am happy to see the responses to Nikolaos's post. Some very good
points are made.
Most of these concerns are known to the community, but the problems
remain:
* the web site is dry and lacks visual appeal. this has been discussed
time and again and we can't find anyone with the artistic talent, the
time, and the will to redesign the site.
* development is not as active as it used to be. i think the framework
has somewhat peaked because it is, for the most part,
feature-complete.
* my own involvement in the framework has been reduced to answering
questions on the mailing list. don't get me wrong--i am not claiming
that i was ever one of the main developers. clearly, Tim and Ben are.
But, when I was working on the book, I was also developing
professionally with Stripes, and the two combined made me very
interested in Stripes' features. A few of the tweaks that made it into
the 1.5 release were directly related to writing the book.
* more on the previous point: I still develop professionally with
Stripes, but have not much interest in any major new features. The
current trunk suits me fine. Any "nice-to-haves" I consider not part
of the core framework, and I put them in Rayures.
* I fully agree with the full-stack idea. This is what Rayures does.
In one minute, you can set up a Stripes project that is ready to run
with Maven, Tomcat plugin, Spring, Hibernate, JPA, Log4J, and TestNG.
* about the lack of developer activity: I think we need some new
blood. I can't speak for Ben, but I think it is too much to ask of him
being almost the sole developer. Personally, I gave my all to write
the book, improve the documentation, contribute to the framework when
I could, write articles (e.g. The Server Side), write blog posts, post
links on DZone, get book reviews, promote Stripes on forums.. But now
I am *burnt out*. As I mentioned earlier, I still answer questions on
the mailing list when I can, but other than that, I need to just be a
happy Stripes *user*.
* more on the previous point: I think there are several people who are
quite skillful, sharp, and competent who would make great developers
for Stripes. I think we need a group of those people to step up and
keep the framework alive. Several names come to mind, but I won't name
them because I don't want to offend anyone by omission, nor do I want
to put anyone on the spot.
* yes I know it is lame when someone says "I'd like feature X" and the
reply is "ok then why don't you implement it?" but sometimes the
person actually says "I did implement it! can you add my code?" But
the problem remains that someone needs to validate the code, decide if
it belongs in the core (lest we bloat the framework, something we've
been trying to avoid and shoud continue to resist), and so on. This is
the job of a "core" group of developers who have the Stripes
philosophy at heart. Unfortunately, since the departure of Tim, this
core seems to have disintegrated. No disrespect at all to Tim by the
way, he created a truly awesome framework and gave me an awesome topic
to write about. I certainly don't blame him for having moved on.
Before this post gets too long (too late!) I guess in conclusion, we
all agree that Stripes needs more steam in terms of development,
marketing, spreading the good word, blogging, revamping the site,
developing bells and whistles--extensions that make you go "wow" but
keeping them outside the core.
Stripes needs more activity. The question is, who is willing to invest
themselves into this goal? Who is willing to take over, for the future
of Stripes?
If there is enough response, how do we "hand over the reigns"?
Cheers,
Freddy
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
This SF.net Dev2Dev email is sponsored by:
Show off your parallel programming skills.
Enter the Intel(R) Threading Challenge 2010.
http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-thread-sfd
_______________________________________________
Stripes-users mailing list
Stripes-users@lists.sourceforge.net
<mailto:Stripes-users@lists.sourceforge.net>
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/stripes-users
--
Ross Sargant
Software Engineer
p: 954-623-6015 x2108
email: rsarg...@tvrc.com <mailto:rsarg...@tvrc.com>
TVR Communications LLC
541 S. State Road 7,Suite 5,Margate, Florida,33068
http://www.tvrc.com
----------------------------------------------------------------------
--
----------------------------------------------------------------------
-------- This SF.net Dev2Dev email is sponsored by:
Show off your parallel programming skills.
Enter the Intel(R) Threading Challenge 2010.
http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-thread-sfd
----------------------------------------------------------------------
--
_______________________________________________
Stripes-users mailing list
Stripes-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/stripes-users
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
This SF.net Dev2Dev email is sponsored by:
Show off your parallel programming skills.
Enter the Intel(R) Threading Challenge 2010.
http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-thread-sfd
_______________________________________________
Stripes-users mailing list
Stripes-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/stripes-users
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This SF.net Dev2Dev email is sponsored by:
Show off your parallel programming skills.
Enter the Intel(R) Threading Challenge 2010.
http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-thread-sfd
_______________________________________________
Stripes-users mailing list
Stripes-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/stripes-users
