I learned programming 1965 on IBM 1130 and have used computers ever since.
1969 I came into professional computing as responsible for starting
timesharing business in Sweden on a 360/50, at that time the 3rd largest
computer in Sweden. After that I have also worked with CAD/CAM and networking.
Breaking in to you house, car or computer without permission, is a crime
and will always be a crime. If I break in to your house and use your your
living room floor as toilet, should I be regarded as a genius and my
excrements as "a creative practical joke"? Give me a break!!!! What kind of
world do we live in, when people suggest that we should admire buglers, car
thiefs, hackers, crackers and whatever you like to call the criminals.
Protection against hackers or virus makers is a security against criminals,
in the same way as the lock on your house. If you have a bad or good lock
does not make the bugler less or more criminal. Even if you do not have a
lock at all, the bugler is a criminal that performs a criminal act.
I can agree that some programmers have to test the security, with
permission and in a controlled way. They same way as locks are tested. If
you have people who wants to test the security on their own computers or
others with permission, it is a perfectly legal exercise. It does not need
a programmer that is smarter than other programmers, who works with
creating applications.
Hakan
At 08:40 AM 12/8/2002 -0500, you wrote:
>If you are new to hacking, you probably assume that computer criminals are
>hackers. Heck, that's what the news media tells us.
>
>However, calling criminals "hackers" makes real hackers angry. Eric
>Raymond, author of "The New Hacker's Dictionary," argues, "Real hackers call
>these people 'crackers' and want nothing to do with them... being able to
>break security doesn't make you a hacker any more than being able to hot
>wire cars makes you an automotive engineer. Unfortunately, many journalists
>and writers have been fooled into using the word 'hacker' to describe
>crackers; this irritates real hackers no end...
>
>"The basic difference is, hackers build things; crackers break them."
>
>The "Hacker Jargon File" (Version 2.9.6, 16 August 1991), adds that "Hacking
>might be characterized as `an appropriate application of ingenuity'.
>Whether the result is a quick-and-dirty patchwork job or a carefully crafted
>work of art, you have to admire the cleverness that went into it. An
>important secondary meaning of {hack} is `a creative practical joke'."
>
>
>
>Steve Spence
>Subscribe to the Renewable Energy Newsletter
>& Discussion Boards. Read about Sustainable Technology:
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>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Hakan Falk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: <biofuel@yahoogroups.com>
>Sent: Sunday, December 08, 2002 5:51 AM
>Subject: [biofuel] Re:Virus protection was: WARNING! - enemy action by Yahoo
>
>
> >
> > Hackers are people who breaks the security and get access to a computer
> > system. Most of them do not make destructive viruses but some use the
>virus
> > to plant Trojans. Virus developers are destructive criminals. Both hackers
> > and virus producers should be pursued legally and not only get a
>sufficient
> > jail term, also be made financially responsible for damages.
> >
> > I am running windows 2000 with Norton virus protection and it works fine
> > with me. I am using Eudora mail client and do not allow for any automatic
> > execution. It is important to use a mail client that are supported by the
> > anti virus software. Norton analyzes all incoming mails and the last years
> > my system have been clean, when I do the weekly scan of my 2x20 Gb disks.
>I
> > scan for viruses one night a week and it takes around 8 hours to do so.
>The
> > Norton software is not expensive and Eudora has a free version
>alternative.
> >
> > I have a couple of other computers for use of others and had some problems
> > on those. I also helped friends to set up security privately and for their
> > companies. It is several times that I have fixed infected computers, that
> > also had anti virus software. Some of this anti-virus software is not
> > updated fast enough and some actually hangs the system. That is why I run
>a
> > non mainstream mail client and Norton who I found have less problems than
> > other virus software.
> >
> > I always tell people not to open any attachments unless they are that are
> > not known to be OK, even if they have a good protected system. Curiosity
>is
> > very dangerous.
> >
> > Hakan
> >
> >
> > At 01:39 AM 12/8/2002 -0800, you wrote:
> > >On Sun, 8 Dec 2002 15:43:32 +0900, you wrote:
> > >
> > > >Hi MM
> > > >
> > > >Thanks for this.
> > > >
> > > >We do at the moment have a member apparently in India with a virus
> > > >that's picking members' names out of his address book and sending
> > > >itself to people, with false sender names of other list members. It's
> > > >impossible to find out who he is from the information that's
> > > >available. I may have tracked down his ISP but all I can get out of
> > > >them so far is an auto-response. I guess it happens all the time, I
> > > >just happen to know of this one. A problem is that so many users know
> > > >so little about using their machines and simply don't know about
> > > >virus gear and how to keep it updated. That seems amazing but it's
> > > >true.
> > >
> > >PS:
> > >
> > >I suppose going forward you could require new members to show evidence
> > >of non-use of one of the offending email clients (Outlook, Outlook
> > >Express, Netscape, whatever), by sending an email with header info
> > >that would indicate this. And-or you could post a link on the signup
> > >area to alternative email clients for Windows users.
> > >
> > >http://www.tucows.com/mail95_default.html
> > >
> > >Looking these over, though, there are several "hazardous" ones in
> > >there (possibly using the inbuilt address book). Mine isn't listed
> > >because its known as a free intergrated usenet reader. I guess maybe
> > >you could list Pegasus and agent.99 as two free email clients, if you
> > >didn't want to confuse people with a huge list. I don't know if
> > >Pegasus has an address book that is vulnerable. As I look at mine,
> > >unfortunately, the free version does not seem to support email, only
> > >usenet:
> > >
> > >http://www.forteinc.com/agent/features.php
> > >
> > >So, that is not an answer as to the zero-cost way to wean windows
> > >users from damaging email clients. Agent looks like it's $29.00
> > >
> > >Anyway, I don't mean to suggest work for you, but if one is the
> > >moderator of a mail list and if this Outlook issue is still causing
> > >work, then maybe discouragement of using it would save work.
> > >
> > >Funny, but I heard on a retreat last year Gates had come back with the
> > >notion that security was going to be a big focus of the company.
> > >Guess they haven't quite solved it all yet. But this failure isn't as
> > >much of a mystery to me because I had the benefit of a conversation
> > >with a hacker 6 years ago about this, and he was quite clear that he
> > >doubted some of Windows Security problems *could* ever be solved,
> > >given its architecture. I've seldom seen him so tickled-pink, so
> > >content, when he was sitting there chuckling, foreseeing how MS would
> > >try to solve this or that and it just wouldn't do any good because
> > >putting that finger in the dike just wasn't going to stop the water
> > >from coming. For some reason, the contemplation of the possibility of
> > >this happening and MS's misery at that point just seemed to make him
> > >sort of quiet and content and satisfied. Maybe he thought, for some
> > >reason, they deserved a bit of misery?
> > >
> > >I don't know about WinXP because that's based on NT, not on DOS. I
> > >didn't "upgrade" to it because I didn't want to lose the functionality
> > >of some apps.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
> > >http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
> > >
> > >Biofuels list archives:
> > >http://archive.nnytech.net/
> > >
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> >
> >
> >
> > Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
> > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
> >
> > Biofuels list archives:
> > http://archive.nnytech.net/
> >
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> >
> >
>
>
>Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
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>
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