howdy mike, here is my reading of the phenomena that mills is describing: he heats atoms (puts energy in) which causes one or more electrons to be excited to a higher energy state. when an electron "falls" back to whence it came, it gives off energy, which can be in the form of light. the wavelength of the light emitted is a function of the energy given off in returning to the ground state. As best I can tell, mills says that the wavelength of light emitted represents more energy the the excitation energy. remember now all this depends on the observation of the wavelength of light emitted (in the UV- get it? black light? blacklight power? I'm not a spectroscopic but my guess is that this only happens when he has a "catalyst" present. maybe a normal electronic transition of the catalyst is being observed, rather than the creation of a new state of matter.
in fact when you think about it catalysts only make reactions happen faster than they would without them. surely since the big bang 12 or so billion years ago some of the atoms would have gotten to this state without a catalyst, yet they are not observed anywhere in the universe, except mills lab. strange indeed. I recall a few, well maybe a bunch of years back Uri Geller was able to convince a bunch of physicists no less that he was actually bending spoons via psychokinesis. He wasn't. http://uri-geller.blogspot.com/2004_12_01_uri-geller_archive.html Jack Sarfatti - PhD, Physicist "My personal judgement as a PhD physicist is that Uri Geller demonstrated genuine psychoenergetic ability at Birkbeck which is beyond the doubt of any reasonable man, under relatively well-controlled and repeated experimental conditions. ". but not so fast, http://skepdic.com/geller.html "If Uri Geller bends spoons with divine powers, then he's doing it the hard way." —James Randi "Because a good magician can do something shouldn't make you right away jump to the conclusion that it's a real phenomenon." —Richard Feynman "Geller is at his ingenious best in laboratories where he is being observed by scientists who believe he has extraordinary ESP ability and think—without justification—that they have ruled out every possibility of fraud." —Milbourne Christopher and here is one for you conspiracy theorists: http://www.unca.edu/news/releases/2005/Maas.html Richard P. Maas, a UNC Asheville environmental studies professor and one of the nation’s leading water quality researchers, died Dec. 12, 2005, following a brief illness. He was 54. note that he is (was)a water quality dude, not alternative energy as claimed in the article. I am still not convinced of anything real here. As noted below, apparently mills was demonstrating this in 1996. why hasn't he produced energy? and just what does he do with his new state of matter? why aren't samples sent to labs to confirm that in fact he has produced a new state of matter? all one would have to do is burn some of his "hydrinos" and compare the emission spectra with that of normal hydrogen- it should be simple, he needn't give away any secrets as to how he produced the new state of matter, etc. check out the image at: http://www.space.com/businesstechnology/blacklight_power_000522.html he shows a vial with a white crystalline material which contains what he claims is hydrino hydride. this has a molecular wt of 2, but it is a solid- amazing indeed? M&K DuPree wrote: > Hi Bob and List...here's something else: > http://prorev.com/2005/11/harvard-doctor-claims-to-have-found.htm An excerpt > from the article reads, "Rick Maas, a chemist at the University of North > Carolina at Asheville who specialises in sustainable energy sources, was > allowed unfettered access to Blacklight's laboratories this year. (2005) 'We > went in with a healthy amount of scepticism. While it would certainly be > nice if this were true, in my position as head of a research institution, I > really wouldn't want to make a mistake. The last thing I want is to be > remembered as the person who derailed a lot of sustainable energy investment > into something that wasn't real.' > > "But Prof Maas and Randy Booker, a UNC physicist, left under no doubt about > Dr Mill's claims. 'All of us who are not quantum physicists are looking at > Dr Mills's data and we find it very compelling,' said Prof Maas. 'Dr Booker > and I have both put our professional reputations on the line as far as that > goes.' > > ERIK BAARD, SPACE - 'Something real is generating energy there,' said Dan > Mears, president of Technology Insights, an energy technology consulting > group in San Diego that investigated BlackLight for a year in 1996 on behalf > of Oregon electric utility Pacificorp. > > 'We were convinced there was excess energy being produced by what he was > then calling 'hydrocatalysis,'' Mears said. So convinced that the team > leader left to work for Black Light for a year before moving on to the > International Atomic Energy Agency in Vienna, he added. Pacificorp signed > on, and was followed by the Mid-Atlantic utility Conectiv. Now Morgan > Stanley Dean Witter wants to usher BlackLight to an initial public > offering." > > Mike DuPree > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "bob allen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <Biofuel@sustainablelists.org> > Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 8:34 AM > Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Fw: Car runs on water > > >> Howdy Mike, I am singularly unimpressed. all the patents (I agree with >> park that the patent office >> has given up trying to define what is real and what is not) and all the >> math-o-babble are not going >> to convince me as easily as simple proof of efficacy: start selling power >> which one extracts from >> what-ever previously unheard of source, and I will believe. >> >> the author of the article, tom bearden claims to have built a replicable >> "overunity" device which >> "extracts energy from the vacuum" whatever that means. But I am left to >> wonder, does his electric >> meter run backwards? in fact, why isn't he producing all sorts of >> products, smelting iron, reducing >> bauxite, producing any number of goods which require energy? If his >> device is real, we should see >> huge transformers out side his bedroom window to take all the power away. >> >> the same is true for Mills device. 100 man-years to develop a heat source? >> give me a break. >> >> "Science is what we have learned about how to keep >> from fooling ourselves" - Richard Feynman >> >> >> somebody is fooling themselves... >> >> >> >> >> >> >> M&K DuPree wrote: >>> Bob, what do you think after reading this: >>> http://www.cheniere.org/misc/mills.htm ??? Mike DuPree >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "bob allen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> To: <Biofuel@sustainablelists.org> >>> Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 9:32 AM >>> Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Fw: Car runs on water >>> >>> >>>> Howdy D, you seem to accept that the "hydrino" is real; that is, that >>>> Mills has discovered a new >>>> form of matter- hydrogen with a never before seen energy state below the >>>> know ground state. Well I'm >>>> going to hold my breath in anticipation. what is your prediction as to >>>> when we will be powering the >>>> world? or even making the meter at his lab run backwards? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> D. Mindock wrote: >>>>> Hi Bob, >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> I automatically reject anything which >>>>>> >>>>>> 1. appears to violate extremely simple laws of thermodynamics >>>>> I think you should be more open, but that's just my opinion. Appearing >>>>> to >>>>> violate the laws does >>>>> not imply that the laws were indeed violated. Sometimes closer >>>>> inspection >>>>> is needed. BTW, the >>>>> Fluctuation Theorem (extension/replacement of the 2nd Law) of Denis >>>>> Evans >>>>> allows, in nanoscale >>>>> systems, violations of the 2nd Law. >>>>> >>>>>> 2. is supported by testimonial, rather than hard data. >>>>> Inventors are always afraid of someone stealing their ideas. Even the >>>>> patent process can be >>>>> intercepted by special interests. It is a Catch-22. >>>> yes, but a catch-22 that charlatans have hidden behind for centuries. >>>> >>>> >>>>> Dr Randell Mills though has got his system of energy creation via >>>>> hydrinos patented. He invites >>>>> any scientist to come to his facility and examine his prototypes. He >>>>> offers unfettered access. >>>>> Some sceptics have stayed as long as a year and came away believers. >>>>> >>>>>> 3. doesn't currently sell power to the grid with the device, even >>>>>> though >>>>>> claims are made of >>>>>> power production. >>>> when he starts selling power, I'll believe it. All it would take is to >>>> build the mousetrap in a >>>> secret box, then connect it to the grid. From his discription I can't >>>> imagine why a 100-man years of >>>> work are necessary- all he is doing is getting more energy out than put >>>> in. He heats a hydrogen >>>> plasma in the presence of a catalyst and claims he gets more out than >>>> in - >>>> it should be a nobrainer, >>>> use the excess heat to boil water, turn a turbine and sell power. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> Dr Mills wants to do that, put power on the grid. As to whether his >>>>> hydrinos can power a car, he >>>>> is working on that. He's confident that it is possible. >>>>> >>>>>> I guess I just have a lower tolerance for fraud, or at least a higher >>>>>> standard for proof. >>>>> Well, why don't you go out to visit his facility? It could be an eye >>>>> opener. >>>> no,no he is making extraordinary claims, so he is going to have a lot >>>> more >>>> proof before I cross the >>>> street. Have you invested in this miracle? here is the link: >>>> >>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>> >>>> >>>> "Science is what we have learned about how to keep >>>> from fooling ourselves" - Richard Feynman >>>> >>>>> www.blacklightpower.org >>>>> >>>>> Peace, D. Mindock >>>>>> D. Mindock wrote: >>>>>>> Bob, You have your mind set already to reject this. This guy is a >>>>>>> successful inventor and >>>>>>> businessman. Did you bother to read the wikipedia reference? I think >>>>>>> not. You already know >>>>>>> it, right? If you did you'd have seen that energies are created that >>>>>>> are not readily >>>>>>> explained. Things have changed from the 1970's, new discoveries are >>>>>>> being made. >>>>>> sure, but the laws of thermodynamics is not one of those things that >>>>>> have changed. toodles. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> Peace, D. Mindock >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "bob allen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: >>>>>>> <Biofuel@sustainablelists.org> Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 8:26 AM >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Fw: >>>>>>> Car runs on water >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> D. Mindock wrote: >>>>>>>>> Bob, The inventor was quite adamant that over unity was being >>>>>>>>> achieved in the early years >>>>>>>>> of development. >>>>>>>> overunity implies (to me anyway) that you get more energy out than >>>>>>>> you >>>>>>>> put in. If that is >>>>>>>> the case, why isn't this guy a bazzillionare? why isn't he selling >>>>>>>> power all over the >>>>>>>> globe? I'll tell you why, 'cause it ain't so. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I think he stopped using this phrase so as not to be seen >>>>>>>>> as a whacko (all breakthrough inventors are seen as such). >>>>>>>> no, he stopped using it because he couldn't support the claim with >>>>>>>> real data. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> He was getting >>>>>>>>> a lot of people interested but that was all. Anyway, some >>>>>>>>> scientists >>>>>>>>> have found >>>>>>>>> temperatures being generated through cavitation to be "off the >>>>>>>>> charts". Something strange >>>>>>>>> is going on. >>>>>>>> I don't see anything strange. I say a lecture on the subject of the >>>>>>>> use sonoluminesence in >>>>>>>> the 70's up put energy in, and you get work -light and heat. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Everytime there is a >>>>>>>>> a dramatic change in physics, there are always those that think it >>>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>>> blasphemy, for >>>>>>>>> awhile. (Cold fusion is still under a dark cloud, but it refuses to >>>>>>>>> go away. Wonder why?) >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> because people want to believe that endless energy abounds just >>>>>>>> around >>>>>>>> the corner? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Then as the science behind it becomes more widely >>>>>>>>> accepted, there is a rapid change towards acceptance. >>>>>>>>> Sonoluminescence is such a thing. >>>>>>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonoluminesence >>>>>>>> yes, but there is nothing magical or which violates any physical >>>>>>>> laws >>>>>>>> involved here. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Temperatures of over a million degrees K. have been found inside >>>>>>>>> collapsing bubbles. >>>>>>>>> Excerpt from wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cavitation >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Cavitating water purification devices have also been designed, in >>>>>>>>> which the extreme >>>>>>>>> conditions of cavitation can break down pollutants and organic >>>>>>>>> molecules. Spectral >>>>>>>>> analysis of light emitted in sonochemical reactions reveal chemical >>>>>>>>> and plasma based >>>>>>>>> mechanisms of energy transfer. The light emitted from cavitation >>>>>>>>> bubbles is termed >>>>>>>>> sonoluminesence. >>>>>>>> sonochemistry and sonoluminesence have been around for years, big >>>>>>>> deal >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Peace, D. Mindock P.S. Now the term "bubble fusion" is entering >>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>> lexicon of physics. >>>>>>>> along with N-rays, polywater, over-unity devices? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "bob allen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>>>>>>> To: >>>>>>>>> <Biofuel@sustainablelists.org> Sent: Thursday, May 11, 2006 7:52 AM >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: >>>>>>>>> [Biofuel] Fw: Car runs on water >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> there is a big difference in the process of heating a liquid via >>>>>>>>>> ultrasonic energy >>>>>>>>>> input (NOTE ENERGY INPUT) and claiming to extract energy from >>>>>>>>>> nowhere. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> D. Mindock wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> Dingel says he wants the money from his inventions to go directly >>>>>>>>>>> to the people of >>>>>>>>>>> the Phillipines. If he were a charlatan he would want the money >>>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>>> himself and then >>>>>>>>>>> disappear with it. IMO, I think he's got something and I hope he >>>>>>>>>>> finds a foundation, >>>>>>>>>>> investor, etc., he trusts enough to get his technology tweaked & >>>>>>>>>>> mass produced. But >>>>>>>>>>> the chances are slim at best. It is the same with other inventors >>>>>>>>>>> like him. One >>>>>>>>>>> exception, (there may be others?) from Rome, Georgia, stopped >>>>>>>>>>> using >>>>>>>>>>> the phrase "over >>>>>>>>>>> unity" and was able to get his product which uses cavitation to >>>>>>>>>>> heat up water, to >>>>>>>>>>> market. He's now got a successful business going. But if he were >>>>>>>>>>> using this to power >>>>>>>>>>> cars, which he doesn't, I doubt if he would be in business. See: >>>>>>>>>>> http://www.hydrodynamics.com/ Peace, D. Mindock >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "robert luis rabello" >>>>>>>>>>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: >>>>>>>>>>> <Biofuel@sustainablelists.org> Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 >>>>>>>>>>> 11:48 >>>>>>>>>>> PM Subject: Re: >>>>>>>>>>> [Biofuel] Fw: Car runs on water >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> miki de mla wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I guess we just have to see the gadget to believe his claims... >>>>>>>>>>>> Be skeptical. Eyes can be deceived. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> robert luis rabello "The Edge of Justice" Adventure for Your >>>>>>>>>>>> Mind >>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.newadventure.ca >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Ranger Supercharger Project Page >>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/ >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ Biofuel mailing >>>>>>>>>>> list >>>>>>>>>>> Biofuel@sustainablelists.org >>>>>>>>>>> http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: >>>>>>>>>>> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives >>>>>>>>>>> (50,000 >>>>>>>>>>> messages): >>>>>>>>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- Bob Allen http://ozarker.org/bob >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> "Science is what we have learned about how to keep from fooling >>>>>>>>>> ourselves" - Richard >>>>>>>>>> Feynman >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ Biofuel mailing >>>>>>>>>> list >>>>>>>>>> Biofuel@sustainablelists.org >>>>>>>>>> http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: >>>>>>>>>> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 >>>>>>>>>> messages): >>>>>>>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ Biofuel mailing >>>>>>>>> list >>>>>>>>> Biofuel@sustainablelists.org >>>>>>>>> http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: >>>>>>>>> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 >>>>>>>>> messages): >>>>>>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- Bob Allen http://ozarker.org/bob >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> "Science is what we have learned about how to keep from fooling >>>>>>>> ourselves" - Richard >>>>>>>> Feynman >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ Biofuel mailing list >>>>>>>> Biofuel@sustainablelists.org >>>>>>>> http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: >>>>>>>> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 >>>>>>>> messages): >>>>>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ Biofuel mailing list >>>>>>> Biofuel@sustainablelists.org >>>>>>> http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: >>>>>>> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 >>>>>>> messages): >>>>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> -- Bob Allen http://ozarker.org/bob >>>>>> >>>>>> "Science is what we have learned about how to keep from fooling >>>>>> ourselves" - Richard Feynman >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ Biofuel mailing list >>>>>> Biofuel@sustainablelists.org >>>>>> http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org >>>>>> >>>>>> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: >>>>>> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html >>>>>> >>>>>> Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 >>>>>> messages): >>>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ >>>>> _______________________________________________ Biofuel mailing list >>>>> Biofuel@sustainablelists.org >>>>> >>>>> http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org >>>>> >>>>> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html >>>>> >>>>> Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 >>>>> messages): >>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> -- >>>> Bob Allen >>>> http://ozarker.org/bob >>>> >>>> "Science is what we have learned about how to keep >>>> from fooling ourselves" - Richard Feynman >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Biofuel mailing list >>>> Biofuel@sustainablelists.org >>>> http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org >>>> >>>> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: >>>> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html >>>> >>>> Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 >>>> messages): >>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Biofuel mailing list >>> Biofuel@sustainablelists.org >>> http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org >>> >>> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: >>> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html >>> >>> Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 >>> messages): >>> http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> -- >> Bob Allen >> http://ozarker.org/bob >> >> "Science is what we have learned about how to keep >> from fooling ourselves" - Richard Feynman >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Biofuel mailing list >> Biofuel@sustainablelists.org >> http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org >> >> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: >> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html >> >> Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 >> messages): >> http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ >> >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > Biofuel mailing list > Biofuel@sustainablelists.org > http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > > Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): > http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ > > > > > -- Bob Allen http://ozarker.org/bob "Science is what we have learned about how to keep from fooling ourselves" - Richard Feynman _______________________________________________ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
