I'm actually convinced that I'd rather use an email client. Having to participate in a web app is a regression in my experience.
Daniel Duan Sent from my iPhone > On Jan 26, 2017, at 10:15 AM, Adrian Zubarev via swift-evolution > <[email protected]> wrote: > > Awesome :) Hopefully that will finally convince the people what ‘are working > on this’ to actually make it ;) > > I could find some really old threads of mine in just seconds. My mail client > cannot do that job that well. > > Cannot wait 🤤 > > -- > Adrian Zubarev > Sent with Airmail > > Am 26. Januar 2017 um 19:03:13, Nate Cook via swift-evolution > ([email protected]) schrieb: > >> >>> On Jan 25, 2017, at 3:32 PM, Douglas Gregor via swift-evolution >>> <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> On Jan 25, 2017, at 12:05 PM, Ted Kremenek via swift-evolution >>>> <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>> I have no problem with the project moving to forums instead of the Mailman >>>> mailing lists we have now — if it is the right set of tradeoffs. >>>> >>>> My preference is to approach the topic objectively, working from goals and >>>> seeing how the mailing lists are aligning with those goals and how an >>>> alternative, such as Discourse, might do a better job. >>>> >>>> The current use of mailing lists has been carry-over of how both LLVM does >>>> public discussion (which is all mailing lists) and how the Swift team at >>>> Apple has used mailing lists for discussion. That inertia has benefits in >>>> that it is a familiar workflow that is “proven” to work — but the doesn’t >>>> mean it is the best option going forward. >>>> >>>> Here are some of the things that matter to me: >>>> >>>> - Topics are easy to manage and search, with stable URLs for archives. >>>> >>>> - It is easy to reference other topics with a stable (canonical) URL that >>>> allows you to jump into that other topic easily. That’s hard to do if you >>>> haven’t already been subscribed to the list. >>>> >>>> - Works fine with email clients, for those who want to keep that workflow >>>> (again this inertia is important). >>>> >>>> - Code formatting, and other tools that add clarity in communication, are >>>> a huge plus. >>>> >>>> I’d like to understand more the subjective comments on this thread, such >>>> as "may intimidate newcomers”. This feels very subjective, and while I am >>>> not disagreeing with that statement I don’t fully understand its >>>> justification. Signing up for mailing lists is fairly straightforward, >>>> and one isn’t obligated to respond to threads. Are forums really any less >>>> “intimating”? If so, why is that the case? Is this simply a statement >>>> about mailing lists not being in vogue? >>>> >>>> I do also think the asynchronous nature of the mailing lists is important, >>>> as opposed to discussions feeling like a live chat. Live chat, such as >>>> the use of Slack the SwiftPM folks have been using, is very useful too, >>>> but I don’t want participants on swift-evolution or any of our mailing >>>> lists feel obligated to respond in real time — that’s simply not the >>>> nature of the communication on the lists. >>>> >>>> So in short, using mailing lists specifically is not sacred — we can >>>> change what we use for our community discussions. I just want an >>>> objective evaluation of the needs the mailing lists are meant to serve, >>>> and work from there. If moving to something like (say) Discourse would be >>>> a negative on a critical piece that is well-served by the mailing lists, >>>> that would (in my opinion) a bad direction to take. I’m not saying that >>>> is the case, just that this is how I prefer we approach the discussion. >>> >>> I’ve looked into Discourse a bit, and it does look very promising. One >>> *specific* way in which a motivated individual could help would be to take >>> a look at Discourse’s import scripts and try importing swift-evolution’s >>> mailing archives with them. We absolutely do not want to lose history when >>> we switch technologies. Do the messages import well? Are threading and >>> topics maintained in a reasonable manner? Does Discourse provide effective >>> UI for looking into past discussions on some specific topic we’re >>> interested in? >>> >>> - Doug >> >> ✋ >> >> I forged the mighty, turgid rivers of rubyenv, hand-tweaked gem >> dependencies, and sed-cleaned mbox files to try this out—you can see the >> results of an import (using one or two day old data) at this address: >> http://discourse.natecook.com/ >> >> It looks like the threads were handled properly, though they bear some >> obvious marks of their mailing list origins. Users can actually claim their >> accounts if they do a password reset. However: >> - it's hooked up to a trial SendGrid account, which will top out at 100 >> emails/day >> - I should probably delete this soon so Google doesn't think it's the real >> deal >> >> I might have mentioned this before, but I'm strongly in favor of forum-based >> solution over the mailing list (at least for this group), and Discourse >> seems to be the best one running right now (and fairly open to extension and >> customization). I made a new topic here to demonstrate a couple features >> (code blocks and inline images): >> http://discourse.natecook.com/t/pitch-add-dark-mode-to-swift/3051 >> >> Thanks - >> Nate >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> swift-evolution mailing list >> [email protected] >> https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution > _______________________________________________ > swift-evolution mailing list > [email protected] > https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution
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