Discussion moved from talk mailing list as it is clearly about tagging details.
Relevant part is quoted so hopefully it is not too confusing. May 25, 2020, 02:45 by [email protected]: > On 25 May 2020, at 01:45, Mateusz Konieczny via talk <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> May 25, 2020, 00:36 by [email protected]: >> >>> >>> I would argue that non-gated driveways are often closer to >>> access=destination than they are to access=private. >>> >>> According to the wiki, private requires individual permission, which I >>> can't give to the mailman / delivery person, but I still want them to make >>> their deliveries on my doorstep. >>> >> I would describe delivery part as >> >> "I have given individual permission to delivery person by requesting >> delivery" >> > > Not all deliveries are actively requested, and the delivery person can't know > if you requested it or not. > Good point. Maybe it can be argued that there is implicit permission for delivery services? My uncle has farm, with clearly private yard (it is unsigned). Postman or package delivery would be welcomed there and - even if package would not be requested, but random person driving to front of his house would not be and AFAIK would violate law. > Therefore, access=private as a _default_ for driveways seems wrong to me. > Here I completely agree. That is why we tag access=private if needed on driveway, and access=yes is basically never tagged. This indicates that we treat "public access" as default value for all highway levels, including driveways. >> Random person driving to my house and trying to sell me random items would >> not be covered by such permission and unwanted and violating access rules, >> right? >> >> Such peddler would be allowed by access=destination (any non-transit >> traffic allowed). >> > > Exactly. In the jurisdictions I'm familiar with, such traffic is in fact > generally allowed on driveways. > > However, some driveways are behind a locked gate or clearly signed as > "private / no trespassing" (which is legally equivalent in some > jurisdictions). Such cases should qualify for an _explicit_ access=private > tag. Delivery to your doorstep might then be impossible, unless there's like > a bell at the gate that can be used by the delivery person to obtain > individual permission. > Sounds OK. > So, access=private for driveways is not necessarily wrong, it's but probably > somewhat rare. > I would be careful with "somewhat rare" - it strongly depends on location, in Poland overwhelming majority (nearly 100% outside rural areas) of driveways will have gates. > Your new language about this on the access=* page seems fine to me: > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:access&oldid=1994851#Road_with_restricted_access > :) > FWIW, I'm less happy with the current state of the access=private page. But > I'm not sure if consensus exists to clarify it. > What is wrong and how you want to change it?
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