Hi Phil and Everyone else,
For the structure number, I like the look of...
ref:AU:VIC:DOT:SN=SN12345
Questions...
1. All caps, for the VIC:DOT:SN suffix?
2. Sure there is no "GOV" in there? ref:AU:*GOV:*VIC:DOT:SN = ???
3. If we had to tag both the structure number and the "structure type"
would this change the convention? Giving something like....
1. ref:AU:VIC:DOT:STRUCTURE:N=SN12345
2. ref:AU:VIC:DOT:STRUCTURE:TYPE=Culvert
Many thanks, as always!
AH
On Thu, 9 Feb 2023 at 13:49, Phil Wyatt <p...@wyatt-family.com> wrote:
> Hi Andrew,
>
>
>
> One way would be by using a ref key
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:ref
>
>
>
> Maybe even something as long as
>
>
>
> ref:AU:VIC:DOT:SN=2252 or maybe
>
>
>
> ref:AU:VIC:DOT=SN2252
>
>
>
> On the culvert makes sense to me but given you seem to want it related to
> the way I will let others chime in on whether it could go on a node on the
> way (similar to the signs we have recently been discussing). Its not
> something I remember having seen in the past (but I have never looked for
> any such points)
>
>
>
> Either way it would be beneficial to at least describe this in the Ozzie
> roads wiki when its settled, maybe under an infrastructure heading.
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Australian_Tagging_Guidelines/Roads
>
>
>
> Cheers - Phil
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Andrew Hughes <ahhug...@gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Thursday, 9 February 2023 1:25 PM
> *To:* Talk Au <talk-au@openstreetmap.org>
> *Subject:* Re: [talk-au] Tagging Culverts on Roads
>
>
>
> Hi All,
>
>
>
> I am resurrecting this thread after quite a long time of silence. I think
> it reached an impasse and went down a lot of rabbit holes. But I do need to
> try my best to get resolution on this.
>
>
>
> To bring it back to life I will ask the question again, hopefully far more
> clarity than I once did in 2020.
>
>
>
> Pretext: For many, culverts are considered to be road infrastructure (they
> are even owned/managed by Govt. transport departments), while others
> consider them to be part of the water course. These question(s) below are
> in the context of those who consider them as road infrastructure. This
> isn't a question around water courses that tag the culvert because that
> already has a (good) tagging convention.
>
>
>
> Context:
>
> Given we have more than 50K culvert's
>
> And a culvert is considered to be part of the road infrastructure (and/or
> independently a watercourse)
>
> And each culvert has a unique asset/ref identification (example Victorian
> Dept of Transport, Structure Number == SN2252)
>
>
>
> Q: How should we create/tag each culvert so that it is (more than just
> geographically) related to the road (way) including its asset/ref
> identification?
>
>
>
> Here's a real world example:
>
>
>
> The culvert (structure SN2252) as GeoJSON can be seen here...
>
>
>
>
> http://geojson.io/#data=data:application/json,%7B%22id%22%3A%22SN2252%22%2C%22type%22%3A%22Feature%22%2C%22geometry%22%3A%7B%22type%22%3A%22Point%22%2C%22coordinates%22%3A%5B144.291749999897%2C-37.0989999997806%5D%7D%2C%22properties%22%3A%7B%22LAT%22%3A-37.099%2C%22LONGIT%22%3A144.29175%2C%22Archived%22%3A%22N%22%2C%22OBJECTID%22%3A8626%2C%22CD_DIRECTION%22%3Anull%2C%22ID_STRUCTURE%22%3A%22SN2252%22%2C%22Archived_Reason%22%3A%22%20%22%2C%22FEATURE_CROSSED%22%3A%22UN-NAMED%20WATERCOURSE%22%2C%22LOCAL_ROAD_NAME%22%3A%222740%20PYRENEES%20HWY%22%2C%22COLLOQUIAL_NAME_1%22%3A%22%20%22%2C%22COLLOQUIAL_NAME_2%22%3Anull%2C%22COLLOQUIAL_NAME_3%22%3Anull%7D%7D
>
>
>
> The location in OSM is...
>
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/edit?way=219077864#map=20/-37.09900/144.29175
> or the closest node
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/edit?node=97560366#map=19/-37.09897/144.29190
> <https://www.openstreetmap.org/edit?node=97560366#map=19/-37.09897/144.29190>
>
>
>
> I will leave it at that for now and let people respond with a fresh slate.
>
>
>
> Thanks Everyone,
>
> Andrew
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, 2 Dec 2020 at 20:13, Mateusz Konieczny via Talk-au <
> talk-au@openstreetmap.org> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Dec 2, 2020, 05:30 by 61sundow...@gmail.com:
>
> On 2/12/20 3:54 am, Mateusz Konieczny via Talk-au wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Dec 1, 2020, 01:17 by 61sundow...@gmail.com:
>
> On 1/12/20 12:18 am, Mateusz Konieczny via Talk-au wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Nov 30, 2020, 13:10 by 61sundow...@gmail.com:
>
> On 27/11/20 11:15 am, Andrew Hughes wrote:
>
> This subject has a long-running chequered past that hasn't reached a
> conclusion
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Tag:tunnel%3Dculvert#.22Tagging_controversy.22_section
>
>
>
> From my understanding, the convention is to tag the water course (i.e.
> river/stream/creek) as tunnel=culvert. It's great as it models where water
> traverses man made structures and I can see it helping many scenarios.
> However, it doesn't help with road usage.
>
>
>
> We need to model/tag the culvert as part of the road infrastructure.
>
>
>
> Would a node that connects both road and water way be sufficient?
>
> That would break current tagging methods that do not merge in one node
> vertically separated
>
> objects like culvert pipe under road or river under bridge or road under
> road on a viaduct.
>
>
>
> OSM uses objects of different levels such as stairs to footways at a
> singular shared node.
>
> In this case you can transition/move between this features.
>
> Would you have the short length of road tagged with a culvert indication
> separate from the waterway culvert indication?
>
> No, I tag waterway=* + tunnel=culvert and do not tag anything on a road.
>
>
>
> And if someone cares about culvert/road crossings they can process OSM
> data,
>
> there is no need at all to tag it manually for over one million of
> culverts.
>
>
>
> And the OP wants to tag weight and width limits for the road as it crosses
> a culvert...
>
> maxweight maxwidth tags on road are well known solution for that
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Talk-au mailing list
> Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
>
>
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