Hi Andrew,

If it were in the documentation I would type the HTML non-breaking hyphen: /‑/ instead of the usual hyphen "-" in the city names. However, other mappers, who probably do not know the HTML coding, may think that it is an error.


In the past we had no such issue. The OSM started to split some city, town, and village names in two lines at a hyphen recently. I would say a month or so ago. But again, in Ukrainian and Russian geographical names a hyphen does not mean the division of a word at the end of a line. But it is an integral part of the name. It is not possible to write Khanty-Mansiysk, Kamianets-Podilskyi, or Bilhorod-Dnistrovskyi without a hyphen, it is out of the question. It would look like an outright spelling error.

On the other hand, displaying them always in two lines even at zooms where there is space around does not seem right either.

I would suggest to use spaces around a hyphen to indicate the division of a word at the end of a line. For example: /divi - sion/ or /divi -sion /would split a word in two lines on the map, but /Bilhorod-Dnistrovskyi/ (without spaces around hyphen) would be rendered in one line.


Best regards,
Oleksiy

On 19.09.2016 10:11, Andrew Errington wrote:
I really like the Korean text, and I'd love to see it go live.

Regarding the incorrect splitting of names at a hyphen, can this be dealt with by using the Unicode non-breaking hyphen?
http://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/2011/index.htm

Mappers would have to type the non-breaking hyphen instead of a regular hyphen, but the renderers should be able to do the right thing if a non-breaking hyphen is used. Otherwise someone has to write a whole bunch of complicated heuristics that would be horrible to maintain.

Unless hyphens in place names should always be treated as non-breaking.

Best wishes,

Andrew

On 19 September 2016 at 16:52, Oleksiy Muzalyev <oleksiy.muzal...@bluewin.ch <mailto:oleksiy.muzal...@bluewin.ch>> wrote:

    On 18/09/16 04:32, Paul Norman wrote:
    I'm looking for feedback from people who read non-latin languages
    on a proposed OpenStreetMap Carto font change.

    We are considering moving to Noto fonts and could use feedback
    from people who can read languages which have non-latin scripts,
    particularly Asian languages. I've made previews in about a dozen
    different languages at
    
https://github.com/gravitystorm/openstreetmap-carto/pull/2349#issuecomment-247819822
    
<https://github.com/gravitystorm/openstreetmap-carto/pull/2349#issuecomment-247819822>
    and want to check that there are no new problems. We may have to
    adjust font sizes, but that's a different issue.

    If you've got feedback, please leave it on
    https://github.com/gravitystorm/openstreetmap-carto/pull/2349
    <https://github.com/gravitystorm/openstreetmap-carto/pull/2349>

    Hi Paul,

    I noticed a slight bug for the Ukrainian alphabet. A hyphen "-"
    can be an integral part of a town name, as opposite to indication
    of the division of a word at the end of a line.

    Here are some examples:

    The name of the city of Kamianets-Podilskyi
    <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kamianets-Podilskyi> (on Google map
    is written correctly, on the OSM map wrongly, always in two lines):

    http://osm.org/go/0hmtaWQg-
    https://www.google.com/maps/@48.6906937,26.5564268,13z?hl=en
    <https://www.google.com/maps/@48.6906937,26.5564268,13z?hl=en>

    The town of Bilhorod-Dnistrovskyi
    <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bilhorod-Dnistrovskyi> (again on
    Google map is written correctly, on the OSM map wrongly, always in
    two lines):

    http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=13/46.1517/30.3499
    <http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=13/46.1517/30.3499>
    https://www.google.com/maps/@46.1562394,30.4138062,11.81z?hl=en
    <https://www.google.com/maps/@46.1562394,30.4138062,11.81z?hl=en>

    It should be at least as Khanty-Mansiysk
    <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khanty-Mansiysk> in Russian
    Federation, in one line at close zooms:

    http://osm.org/go/2xZYTDR-
    https://www.google.com/maps/@61.0084264,69.0622292,12.98z?hl=en
    <https://www.google.com/maps/@61.0084264,69.0622292,12.98z?hl=en>

    or even better always in one line. For example, we do not write on
    the map the names of New York or San Francisco in two lines.

    The names of these towns in Ukrainian are /Кам'янець-Подільський
    /and /Білгород-Дністровський. /They are written normally in one
    line. These are well-known towns in local culture. The first was
    founded in 12th century, the second in 6th century BC (it's one of
    the most ancient cities of with a continuous existence).

    Best regards,
    Oleksiy


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