texascavers Digest 11 May 2009 01:32:16 -0000 Issue 756
Topics (messages 10666 through 10676):
Re: rabies
10666 by: George-Paul Richmann
10667 by: George-Paul Richmann
10669 by: Terry Plemons
10672 by: stephengutting2.juno.com
10673 by: Lyndon Tiu
10674 by: Bill Bentley
Re: rabies pre- and post-exposure shots
10668 by: Jim Kennedy
WNS Letter to Salazar
10670 by: Minton, Mark
Kiwi Sink
10671 by: Ernest Garza
Re: McKittrick Hill Resto help wanted
10675 by: Karen Perry
Evidence mounts people may also spread bat disease :
10676 by: JerryAtkin.aol.com
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--- Begin Message ---
Jen and I both got our shots (long story involving me on rope during a
bat flight....). Given cavers exposure to bats ( I know I know less
then 1% of bats, bla bla bla) should it be common practice to get the
pre-exposure series?
I had the complete post exposure series last year. Wasn't all that
bad, a shot in the arm every weeks for a few months (not in gut any
more). The worst part of it all was mental, Rabies isn't a nice
subject to dwell on---especially when it relates to you ! Starting
symptoms are 'feeling of dread' and mild fever....talked about a
psychosomatics dream!!
Cheers,
GP
On Fri, May 8, 2009 at 9:39 AM, Mixon Bill <[email protected]> wrote:
> "If untreated, though, rabies, which attacks the central nervous system, is
> often fatal in humans." That's a spectacular understatement. -- Mixon
> ---------------------------------------------
> He who renders warfare fatal to all engaged in it will be the greatest
> benefactor the world has yet known. - Sir Richard Burton
> ----------------------------------------------
> You may "reply" to the address this message
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--
George-Paul Richmann
(513) 490-3100
[email protected]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jen and I both got our shots (long story involving me on rope during a
bat flight....). Given cavers exposure to bats ( I know I know less
then 1% of bats, bla bla bla) should it be common practice to get the
pre-exposure series?
I had the complete post exposure series last year. Wasn't all that
bad, a shot in the arm every weeks for a few months (not in gut any
more). The worst part of it all was mental, Rabies isn't a nice
subject to dwell on---especially when it relates to you ! Starting
symptoms are 'feeling of dread' and mild fever....talked about a
psychosomatics dream!!
Cheers,
GP
On Fri, May 8, 2009 at 9:39 AM, Mixon Bill <[email protected]> wrote:
> "If untreated, though, rabies, which attacks the central nervous system, is
> often fatal in humans." That's a spectacular understatement. -- Mixon
> ---------------------------------------------
> He who renders warfare fatal to all engaged in it will be the greatest
> benefactor the world has yet known. - Sir Richard Burton
> ----------------------------------------------
> You may "reply" to the address this message
> came from, but for long-term use, save:
> Personal: [email protected]
> AMCS: [email protected] or [email protected]
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> Visit our website: http://texascavers.com
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
> For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]
>
>
--
George-Paul Richmann
(513) 490-3100
[email protected]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The post-exposure rabies vaccination is now quite painless and has no side
effects. About five years ago I accidentally placed my hand on a bat while
exploring a fort on the Mesa de Cartujanos near Lampazos. I went to
Brackenridge Hospital in Austin to get the shots. On the first day there are
five shots, all painless, one in in each thigh, two in the butt and one in
the arm. There are a few followup shots over a few weeks, also painless.
There were no reactions of any kind.
Terry Plemons
On Fri, May 8, 2009 at 10:15 AM, George-Paul Richmann
<[email protected]>wrote:
> Jen and I both got our shots (long story involving me on rope during a
> bat flight....). Given cavers exposure to bats ( I know I know less
> then 1% of bats, bla bla bla) should it be common practice to get the
> pre-exposure series?
>
> I had the complete post exposure series last year. Wasn't all that
> bad, a shot in the arm every weeks for a few months (not in gut any
> more). The worst part of it all was mental, Rabies isn't a nice
> subject to dwell on---especially when it relates to you ! Starting
> symptoms are 'feeling of dread' and mild fever....talked about a
> psychosomatics dream!!
>
> Cheers,
>
> GP
>
> On Fri, May 8, 2009 at 9:39 AM, Mixon Bill <[email protected]>
> wrote:
> > "If untreated, though, rabies, which attacks the central nervous system,
> is
> > often fatal in humans." That's a spectacular understatement. -- Mixon
> > ---------------------------------------------
> > He who renders warfare fatal to all engaged in it will be the greatest
> > benefactor the world has yet known. - Sir Richard Burton
> > ----------------------------------------------
> > You may "reply" to the address this message
> > came from, but for long-term use, save:
> > Personal: [email protected]
> > AMCS: [email protected] or [email protected]
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Visit our website: http://texascavers.com
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
> > For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> George-Paul Richmann
> (513) 490-3100
> [email protected]
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> Visit our website: http://texascavers.com
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
> For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jim,
Maybe you would like to clarify some of the possible risk factors.
The reason I posted this article to the list, is because there is the need for
vigilance in light of the fact that viruses and bacteria mutate and adapt to
vaccines.
(A mutated form of TB (XDR-TB is now returning with no known cure.
The WHO (World Health Organization) reports 40,000 new cases annually.)
This particular strain of the rabies virus in Arizona, is common
to Brown Bats, but seems to be able to transfer between species, by casual
contact.
I was at Bracken Bat cave many times in the early 70's, and heard the
stories of rabies experiments , where several types of animals were kept in
cages,
in the cave. Even though it was not possible for the bats to bite, or scratch
the animals,
several reportedly, did contract rabies. The Center for Disease Control, says
it is possible
to contract rabies by saliva contact from an infected animal that gets into a
persons eyes, nose, or mouth. See: http://www.cdc.gov/rabies/bats.html
It has been talked about in caving circles that cavers do have a slight
immunity
to rabies due to our increased contact with bats, and their airborne saliva.
Not being a biologist, I have assumed these stories to be true. With new
strains of the rabies virus being discovered, maybe the old rules will not
apply.
Steve
____________________________________________________________
Save on Moving Supplies. Click Here!
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsO5rrfRXKmFJmInNubOIrFLmFUCNknWQQKtBE9ER0xfCN50ILNuGM/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
It has been talked about in caving circles that cavers do have a slight immunity
to rabies due to our increased contact with bats, and their airborne saliva.
We need to go caving more, to build stronger immunity!
--
Lyndon Tiu
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0079631/
http://www.imdb.com/media/rm1435474176/tt0200469
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0130204/
At least Hollywood is always doing their part..
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lyndon Tiu" <[email protected]>
Cc: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, May 08, 2009 8:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] RE: rabies
> > It has been talked about in caving circles that cavers do have a slight
immunity
> > to rabies due to our increased contact with bats, and their airborne
saliva.
>
> We need to go caving more, to build stronger immunity!
>
> --
> Lyndon Tiu
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> Visit our website: http://texascavers.com
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
> For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Fellow Cavers,
I work with bats every day. I also cave almost every week. So I feel
pretty confident in this topic. I can truly say that unless I had a job
where I worked with bats (or other wildlife), that I would NOT get the
rabies pre-exposure vaccine. It is five shots, over a series of months,
and is really expensive (usually around $700). For most cavers, there
is little or no chance of contracting rabies. That is, unless you do
something stupid like pick up one of the animals and get bitten. The
pre-exposure series does not make you "immune" to rabies, all it does is
reduce the number of shots (to 3) that you have to get if you are bitten
by a rabid animal. The efficacy of the vaccine can diminish over time.
Each year, I have a blood draw to check my blood titer. If the rabies
antibodies in my system are lower than a recommended level, I get a
booster shot. If I get bit by a suspect animal, I go in and get the
post-exposure shots. None of them are particularly painful or make me
sick. Tetanus shots are much worse. John must have had an unusual
reaction. Bottom line: save your money, don't get the shots, but don't
do anything stupid, either.
Jim Kennedy, Conservation Biologist
Cave and Mine Resources Specialist
Bat Conservation International
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Below is the text of a letter sent by Congress (13 Senators and 12
Representatives) to Interior Secretary Ken Salazar requesting funds for WNS
research. Thanks to Ray Keeler.
Mark Minton
May 5, 2009
The Honorable Ken Salazar
Secretary
U.S. Department of the Interior
1849 C Street, NW
Washington, D.C. 20240
Dear Secretary Salazar:
We are faced with an alarming ecological situation in the Northeast. Over the
last two winters over one million hibernating bats have mysteriously died.
While scientists have not been able to determine the precise cause of these
deaths, with mortality rates in some caves as high as 90 to 100 percent, the
bats appear to be infected with a fungus that turns their noses and bodies
white. This affliction of unknown origin, dubbed White-Nose Syndrome (WNS),
must be stopped. We ask for your full support to respond to this crisis by
providing immediate, emergency Fiscal Year 2009 funding for the U.S. Fish and
Wildlife Service and U.S. Geological Survey to respond to this crisis.
The first case of WNS was reported in the winter of 2006 in Howes Cave, near
Albany, New York. Scientists working for the New York Department of
Environmental Conservation observed hibernating bats with a previously
unidentified white fungus on their noses and bodies. Since then, confirmed
cases of WNS have shown up in nine states: Connecticut, Massachusetts, New
Hampshire, New Jersey, New York, Pennsylvania, Vermont, Virginia, and West
Virginia. In addition, there are unconfirmed WNS reports in Rhode Island. Given
what we have seen in the past three years, it is highly likely that WNS will
spread from the northeast into some of the largest and most diverse bat
colonies in the nation, which are located in the southeast, Mid-Atlantic, and
Midwest. If this happens, we risk the possibility of extinction of several bat
species.
This issue has profound public health, environmental, and economic
implications. Bats are among the most beneficial animals. We are just beginning
to fully appreciate the roles that bats play in North American ecosystems, and
it is clear that threats like WNS have the potential to influence ecosystem
function in ways that we currently do not understand. They prey almost
exclusively on insects such as mosquitoes, which spread disease, and moths and
beetles, which damage crops. A single bat can easily eat more than 3,000
insects a night and an entire colony will consume hundreds of millions of these
crop-destroying and disease-carrying pests every year. Bats reduce the need for
pesticides, which cost farmers billions of dollars every year and are harmful
to human health.
States, in partnership with the Fish and Wildlife Service and the U.S.
Geological Survey, have been working diligently to establish a cause for this
deadly mystery. With extremely limited resources, scientists have been working
to determine a cause and develop solutions to this crisis, while minimizing its
impact on populations of hibernating bats in North America. Additional
research, work, and proper resources are needed to fully address this crisis.
We respectfully request that the Department of the Interior provide adequate
funding to the Fish and Wildlife Service, the U.S. Geological Survey, and other
agencies to carry out critical research on and develop a cure for WNS. As the
bats emerge from their hibernation caves, it is vital that researchers have the
resources in place to conduct tests this summer. We must do everything we can
to stop the spread of WNS or it will continue to spread across the country
decimating our bat populations. We ask for your help in providing immediate,
emergency funding for the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service and the U.S.
Geological Survey for research, management, coordination, and outreach in order
to provide an appropriate coordinated response to this deadly, newly emergent
disease.
Thank you for your attention to this urgent matter. We look forward to your
prompt response to this inquiry.
Signers:
1. Senator Patrick Leahy
2. Senator Bernard Sanders
3. Senator Robert C. Byrd
4. Senator Charles E. Schumer
5. Senator Frank R. Lautenberg
6. Senator Robert Menendez
7. Senator John F. Kerry
8. Senator Jim Webb
9. Senator Robert P. Casey, Jr.
10. Senator Mark R. Warner
11. Senator Kirsten E. Gillibrand
12. Senator John D. Rockefeller IV
13. Senator Joseph I. Lieberman
14. Representative Peter Welch
15. Representative John McHugh
16. Representative Joe Courtney
17. Representative John Olver
18. Representative Peter Visclosky
19. Representative Charlie Gonzalez
20. Representative Rick Boucher
21. Representative Maurice Hinchey
22. Representative Carolyn C. Kilpatrick
23. Representative Robert Wexler
24. Representative Carol Shea-Porter
25. Representative Lloyd Doggett
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Austin area diggers:
Will try to dig again on Sunday afternoon. Diggers needed--a few
rocks out of the way and the lead continues. Location: across the street
from 444 Billie Brooks Ln., Driftwood.
Dig on,
Ernie Garza
ph. 512-847-0183
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
If anyone wants to help do some restoration work on McKittrick Hill this coming
weekend or the last weekend in May, please let me ASAP. Out of towners are
welcome to stay with me. Bring a sleeping bad, I got the comfy rest. 575 887
9783 in the evenings or [email protected]. For those that don't yet know, I
am now living in Carlsbad.
Thanks,
Karen
--- On Fri, 5/8/09, Carl Pagano <[email protected]> wrote:
From: Carl Pagano <[email protected]>
Subject: [NMCAVER] SWR auction proposal
To: "nmcaver list" <[email protected]>
List-Post: [email protected]
Date: Friday, May 8, 2009, 11:37 PM
Hi folks.
In order to alleviate the "money shortage" alluded to in the SWR, I propose
that at the Winter Tech this year we have an SWR auction. Items could be
anything, including that nasty gag gift you got at your own grotto Christmas
Party (anybody still got the talking fish from the Sandia Grotto party?), to
recycled auction stuff from other grotto auctions, to a free night's stay (on
the floor) at the Belski residence. Who knows, some might even donate some good
stuff to be auctioned.....
Seriously, I feel that this is a great idea, and should be put forth and
voted on at the upcoming SWR at Ft. Stanton. It's proven to be an excellent
(almost only) source of funds for the Sandia Grotto.
Why not do this for the Region and have some fun in the process.
Remember, one person's junk is....well, another person's junk also, but new
junk.....
Carl.....
_______________________________________________
NMCAVER mailing list
[email protected]
http://caver.net/mailman/listinfo/nmcaver_caver.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
_Evidence mounts people may also spread bat disease_
(http://www.boston.com/lifestyle/green/greenblog/2009/05/evidence_mounting_people_may_also_be_spre
ading_bat_disease.html)
May 9, 2009 08:39 AM
By Beth Daley, Globe Staff
As white nose syndrome, the devastating illness that is killing hundreds of
thousands of bats marches its way across the country, officials are trying
to ensure humans aren’t inadvertently spreading it.
Bats with white nose in a Chester, Mass. mine (USFWS)
The U.S. Forest Service recently closed caves and mines on their property
for a year in the Eastern and Southern regions which stretches from Maine to
Florida and west to Minnesota and Oklahoma. Meanwhile the U.S. Fish and
Wildlife Service in April asked the public to observe a voluntary caving ban
in 17 states and the International Congress of Speleology canceled trips in
those states.
Scientists don’t know for sure what is transmitting the disease which
paints affected bats with a white fuzzy fungus and depletes their fat reserves
so greatly it appears many are starving to death. While researchers suspect
bats are probably spreading the disease among each other, there is mounting
evidence that humans may be aiding.
That’s because the fungus persists in caves and mines year-round and its
spores can easily attach to skin, clothing and equipment – and may be able to
survive for weeks or months afterward. Another clue is that white nose
seemed to leapfrog over other states this year - taking hold in West Virginia
and Virginia caves popular with miners.
“We suspect that white-nose syndrome may be transmitted by humans
inadvertently carrying WNS from cave to cave where bats hibernate,” said
Northeast
Regional Director Marvin Moriarty of the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service
said in a recent press release.
Last week, 25 U.S. Senators and Representatives, including several from New
England, urged U.S. Interior Secretary Ken Salazar for more money to help
study and slow the disease.
For more information about white nose, go to
_http://www.fws.gov/northeast/white_nose.html_
(http://www.fws.gov/northeast/white_nose.html)
_http://www.boston.com/lifestyle/green/greenblog/2009/05/evidence_mounting_p
eople_may_also_be_spreading_bat_disease.html_
(http://www.boston.com/lifestyle/green/greenblog/2009/05/evidence_mounting_people_may_also_be_spreading_ba
t_disease.html)
**************Recession-proof vacation ideas. Find free things to do in
the U.S.
(http://travel.aol.com/travel-ideas/domestic/national-tourism-week?ncid=emlcntustrav00000002)
--- End Message ---
