All, Actually i don't mind all the chatter, gives me more information regarding all of the topic really.
Been interested in time, on a social level since military school, where "clock drift" was my #1 excuse for being late to class. :) 73 -Lenny Story N1YEZ On Sat, Mar 26, 2011 at 10:36 PM, paul swed <[email protected]> wrote: > Actually from what I have seen John it is indeed pretty large and does jump > for many reasons. The sun maybe wx. But when you think about the local > oscillator and that is pretty stable and not jumping. Then over time the > phase of wwvb should come back to a predetermined position or lots of > measured points should hang around a particular time. How fine grain that > might be is hard to say. The other thing is the 90 degree phase shift at 15 > after the hour as I recall that has to be accounted for. But again > predictable and the results of whats measured can be stored for a long > time. > > Anyhow this is Lenny's thread do not want to take it over. > Regards > Paul > > > On Sat, Mar 26, 2011 at 9:53 PM, J. Forster <[email protected]> wrote: > > > Paul, > > > > I did that years ago in a qualitative way. > > > > I used a local reference of an HP 105B and the 117A w/ HP loop. I synced > a > > Tek 7854 to the local standard and watched and averaged the recovered 60 > > KHz. I no longer remember the results well, but sometimes the "seeing" > was > > <1uS P-P and on other days it was at least 10s of uS to hundreds of uS. > > > > This may be hard for some to believe, but the seeing seemed to depend on > > weather. A big front coming east would make the "seeing" much worse. This > > was just a casual observation. I never spent much time studying it. If I > > saw the seeing was horid, I just left the stuff running and went away. > > > > Best, > > > > -John > > > > ================== > > > > > > > > > Interesting thread and welcome to time-nuts. > > > > > > Well I suppose since LORAN C has been shut down and I have to say not > > > having > > > a lot of luck with LORAN from Europe I have dusted off the ole WWVB > > > receivers. Actually they have been a live a long time. Just spoiled by > > > LORAN > > > and GPS.. > > > My actual interest is a Tracor 599 and I do have 2 X HP 117s and a loop > > > antenna with preamp about 140' from the house. > > > > > > A couple of things I am thinking about. Considering many on time-nuts > > have > > > very accurate rubidium or better references or GPS trained Oscillators > I > > > was > > > going to look at the propagation changes from a semi stable reference > > > perspective since the local references are quite stable over time. > > > > > > Measuring over time would indeed give you an idea about the strange and > > > wacky 60 KHZ propagation beyond diurnal shift. > > > > > > Ultimately could better information be obtained over significant time > so > > > that you might have an alternate to GPS. There are articles that were > > > published in the 60s by HP and others that describe what might be > > > expected. > > > I am just thinking we have a lot of additional technology, methods and > > > tools > > > that they did not have. Like laptops that can remember 100s of days > worth > > > of > > > data and process the heck out of it. Not that you need that much. > > > > > > So I have to troubleshoot an oddity in the 599. John, its loosing lock. > > Is > > > it broken, is it propagation.... Tough to say. After all its 70s > vintage > > > could be cranky caps or even handfuls of transistors.By the way I did > > > build > > > a 60 KHZ xmitter and by golly it does stay locked very nicely. That > still > > > doesn't mean somethings not broken. > > > > > > Also I need to build a 60 KC breakout/buffer box so that all three > rcvrs > > > can > > > operate at the same time and their outputs can be scaled to the > recorder. > > > Have a very fine box just need to do it. > > > > > > Lenny I am south of Boston. Think Johns from around here also. > > > Regards > > > Paul > > > WB8TSL > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Mar 26, 2011 at 9:09 PM, Lenny Story <[email protected]> > > wrote: > > > > > >> All, > > >> > > >> I think you may be right. Although i did read somewhere that this > design > > >> was > > >> originally just a technical example of an ATMEL 8-bit DSP ... not sure > > >> though. > > >> > > >> -Lenny > > >> > > >> On Sat, Mar 26, 2011 at 8:48 PM, Hal Murray <[email protected]> > > >> wrote: > > >> > > >> > > > >> > [email protected] said: > > >> > > As i stated earlier, i'm using a CMMR-60p, which seems to just be > a > > >> small > > >> > > DSP. > > >> > > > >> > The data sheet at SparkFun shows that it's just an analog receiver > > >> with a > > >> > peak detector and AGC. > > >> > > > >> > Does anybody have any ideas on how much better you could do with an > > >> ADC > > >> and > > >> > DSP? > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > -- > > >> > These are my opinions, not necessarily my employer's. I hate spam. > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > _______________________________________________ > > >> > time-nuts mailing list -- [email protected] > > >> > To unsubscribe, go to > > >> > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > > >> > and follow the instructions there. > > >> > > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> time-nuts mailing list -- [email protected] > > >> To unsubscribe, go to > > >> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > > >> and follow the instructions there. > > >> > > > _______________________________________________ > > > time-nuts mailing list -- [email protected] > > > To unsubscribe, go to > > > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > > > and follow the instructions there. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > time-nuts mailing list -- [email protected] > > To unsubscribe, go to > > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > > and follow the instructions there. > > > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- [email protected] > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > _______________________________________________ time-nuts mailing list -- [email protected] To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
