Tim Shoppa wrote:
>
> Maybe I'm just a networking dinosaur, but why a router or firewall
> would even want to connection tracking on a connectionless
> protocol like NTP over UDP is beyond me.
>   
The "problem" is that most home routers are NA(P)T routers.
It has even become that bad, that to get a system connected to an ADSL line
transparently is becoming a real problem.   For example, here in the 
Netherlands
all ADSL lines are delivered with a free Thomson/Alcatel SpeedTouch 
modem/router.

The old versions of this device (up to v4 of the hardware) could be 
tweaked to
transparently bridge the PPP over ATM connection to a single system 
connected
to the ethernet port.  So, on my system one of my ethernet cards has my 
external
IP address configured as its address, and my (old) SpeedTouch transparently
bridges this to PPPoATM.   No routing, no NAT.

Newer versions (v5 and upwards) no longer can do this.  The ethernet side
operates a DHCP server and your systems get a dynamic address.  All Internet
traffic is NAT-translated between the outside address and your 
internally used
address.   Via some trickery you can arrange that your internal system 
gets the
same address as your external line, but then the NAT engine *still* is 
between
them, translating everything 1:1 but needlessly keeping all its 
connection tables.

For NTP service you would do a port mapping of the incoming packets to 
port 123
to the internal system, and the router (needlessly) keeps a "session" 
for each
external system sending a packet to you, your reply back, and then keeps 
that
for some small amount of time.

This table will overflow.  And the router will malfunction no matter 
what, when you
put heavy traffic through it, or use IPsec.
I have tried really hard to get this issue registered at the Thomson 
helpdesk,
and they patiently listen but only suggest all kinds of methods (via the GUI
or the commandline interface) that finally result in the 1:1 NAT being 
present.
This makes all new Thomson devices essentially useless except for the 
typical
home with 1-4 Windows PCs surfing the Internet, of course their biggest
audience.  I never heard anything back on a request to put back the old 
bridging.

I have looked many times, but I still have not found a worthy replacement of
the old line of Thomson/Alcatel modems (SpeedTouch Home, 510, 516, 546)
in their old (v4 and before) hardware versions.  Everything on sale now is a
NAT router, bare ADSL modems are a thing of the past, it seems.

Other manufacturers usually have similar issues.  Even the routers based on
Linux do.  This makes a sturdy NTP server a little hard to do.
Although on a Linux-based router it could of course be run on the router and
hopefully avoid the problem, at least when connection tracking is not 
used for
that UDP port (of course it is useless).

Rob
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