Unfortunately many schools w ,Sent from my iPad
On Sep 11, 2011, at 1:24 PM, "Lilienfeld, Scott O" <[email protected]> wrote: > Jim - Yes, well put. My primary concern, which you've explained well, is > that the increasingly common practice among clinical Ph.D. programs of > accepting only students who wish to pursue academic/research careers may > inadvertently widen the already wide science-practice gap. Clinically > oriented students who are scientifically minded or at least open to > scientific approaches (and yes, many such students do exist) will instead go > largely to Psy.D. programs where, as Jim notes, they will typically receive > training that is not scientifically rigorous (there are a few honorable > exceptions among Psy.D. programs, like Rutgers, Argosy in DC, and perhaps > Denver, as Annette observes, but in my experience these are outliers). > > An argument I've made in my own clinical program, with minimal success, is > that our field desperately needs scientiifically-minded practitioners to > deliver evidence-based interventions, serve as scientific role models for > their fellow clinicians, supervise graduate students in > scientifically-grounded assessment and treatment techniques, offer continuing > education workshops that integrate science with practice, and so on. I very > much worry that the current trend of discouraging scientifically-minded > students who aspire to practice careers from applying to clinical Ph.D. > programs will deprive the field of practitioners who have received high > quality scientific training. > > But at the risk of being cynical, most of my academic colleagues here and > at other research-oriented clinical psychology programs are less concerned > about the future of the field at large than with the success of their own > research activities. That's where the reinforcement contigencies lie. These > faculty members want research-oriented students to staff and run their > laboratories and help them with their grant-funded research, so the current > admissions system works well for them. But we may pay a price in the long > run. > > .....Scott > > ________________________________________ > From: Jim Clark [[email protected]] > Sent: Sunday, September 11, 2011 12:30 PM > To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) > Subject: RE: [tips] Clinical training: Boulder and Denver > > Hi > > James M. Clark > Professor of Psychology > 204-786-9757 > 204-774-4134 Fax > [email protected] > >>>> "Lilienfeld, Scott O" <[email protected]> 11-Sep-11 7:36:26 AM >>> > But more and more, Boulder model programs are discouraging students with > primary career interests in clinical practice from applying for graduate > school, largely because dozens and dozens of Psy.D programs are already > available to do that (and there's no research evidence that Ph.D.s are > associated with superior therapy outcomes to Psy.D.s). Also, the costs of > graduate training at most clinical psychology programs are enormous (e.g., at > Emory, we fund offer guaranteed funding for 4 years, with full tuition > remissiion, about a $17,000 a year stipend, coverage of health insurance and > other fees; and our clinical program is not markedly atypical from other > clinical Ph.D. programs), and many graduate programs do not want to invest > >$100,000 and years of research training in a student who will go out and > perform full-time therapy, especially when there is no evidence (and pretty > good evidence to the contrary from meta-analyses) that their treatment > outcomes will be superior to those of B.A. level paraprofessionals (I have > decidedly mixed feelings about this argument, but take it for what it is). > > JC > > One potential downside to this division is that it would appear to give up on > the possibility that in the future psychological practice might have stronger > scientific foundations that require a deeper understanding of human behavior > and experience than can be transmitted in an undergraduate degree or even in > a PsyD (especially as currently constituted). It is hard to draw complete > parallels with other professions that do not have PhDs as the top > professional degree, but MDs do differ from Nurses, Dentists differ from > Dental Hygenists, and so on. Psychological practice based on an > undergraduate degree would appear to place psychology on par with Social > Workers and Occupational Therapists. And the shortcomings in the current > versions of PsyDs, as alluded to by Scott, means perhaps that PsyDs are not a > lot better than undergraduate degrees (my interpretation, not necessarily > Scott's). > > Another problem is that we relinquish training of practitioners to > institutions that are generally less completely scientific than university > psychology departments and that are probably outright anti-scientific in some > cases. What does that augur for the future interface between the Clinical > Scientists and Practitioners? To again draw an analogy with Medicine, would > the results of research in the medical field be less likely to be > disseminated and adopted widely if the researchers were not trained initially > as practitioners? Indeed, it even seems at least unusual to think of, for > example, a Prostate Cancer research centre that was not headed by a medical > practitioner and that did not also serve as a primary treatment centre. > > Take care > Jim > > > > --- > You are currently subscribed to tips as: [email protected]. > To unsubscribe click here: > http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13509.d0999cebc8f4ed4eb54d5317367e9b2f&n=T&l=tips&o=12584 > or send a blank email to > leave-12584-13509.d0999cebc8f4ed4eb54d5317367e9...@fsulist.frostburg.edu > > ________________________________ > > This e-mail message (including any attachments) is for the sole use of > the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged > information. 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