On Sun, Oct 12, 2025 at 11:40:36AM -0700, Tim Bray wrote: > That does it. Blocked. My time and attention is my most precious resource > and I don’t want to unsubscribe. -T
[FYI the above comes off as potentially an attempt to enforce conformity given your stature. I hope that's just a misimpression on my part. Of course DJB also uses his stature, but IMO not in this way.] I've not followed all the vagaries of this case closely, but it does seem to me that the WG and the IESG and the IETF ought to set some policy, and that they can set policy, about things like "shall we allow PQ-only suites?", and that this is important. It should also be fair to set no such policy. In the absence of such a policy then support for an I-D that specifies PQ-only suites is -I think- sufficient to adopt regardless of opposition on the basis that we shouldn't. But opposition is evidence that we should first decide the matter of whether to adopt such a policy. This matters because otherwise the IETF is a pay-to-play SDO with maybe a few "adults in the room" (the IESG) who can say "no" or force changes. Currently the appearance is that indeed the IETF is a pay-to-play SDO -- at least others are saying so, therefore the appearance of this is real, though perhaps the appearance is incorrect. IMO DJB's appeal in this case should be heard. Side issues like whether by posting we grant the IETF the right to make substantial changes to our posts, or what constitutes "substantial", are interesting too. I would expect only minimal changes like adding a mailing list name to posts' Subject line. Similarly for PDFs, except maybe to add a copyright statement given that it is a NOTE WELL contribution. Regarding the NOTE WELL, I do agree with Lloyd and others that it is not plausible for regular IETF attendees and even regular mailing-list-only participants to not be aware of it. Though it is plausible some just don't read the fine print. And it's plausible that DJB was aware but didn't understand the consequences. I've not looked at just how substantial the changes in question were, so it's possible that's much ado about not much. Nico -- _______________________________________________ TLS mailing list -- [email protected] To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected]
