I’m noting for the record that the AD asked for this to be moved to its own thread and then, once it was, stopped answering it.
Nadim Kobeissi Symbolic Software • https://symbolic.software > On 28 May 2026, at 8:59 PM, Nadim Kobeissi <[email protected]> wrote: > > Deb, > > Moving [1] to a separate thread, per your request. > > You're right about several things: chairs keep their own lives and opinions, > there is no requirement for separate identities, and the guidelines for > conduct carry no machinery for policing what anyone does on a personal > platform. I am not asking you to monitor anyone's account. > > I do want to push back, with respect, on one part of the principle as stated, > that what a chair does on a personal platform is, for that reason alone, none > of the IETF's concern. I don't think that can be the rule, and the cleanest > way to see it is the limiting case: if a chair posted an overt racial slur > about participants in this group, none of us would say "personal platform, > not our business." What makes such a post the IETF's concern is not where it > was typed; it is its effect on the environment for the people in this group, > and its bearing on whether that person can still hold a role that depends on > their trust. Location is not the test. Effect, and the requirements of the > role, are. I am not equating a "go work at Whole Foods" jab with an overt > slur, I raise the extreme only to locate the line, because once we agree the > line is not "personal platform = off-limits," what remains is the > proportionate question actually in front of us. > > Furthermore, on a personal note, I absolutely feel less safe participating in > the TLS WG if I know that I stand to be publicly ridiculed with the chairs > endorsing statements that I leave cryptography and go find other work (or > worse kinds of personal attacks; I can think of a few), if I post something > that they disagree with. There is no question in my mind that I would at this > point actively and strongly discourage all of my Lebanese students from ever > participating in the TLS WG. > > And at its far lesser magnitude, there is a different question here: not > whether the chair is entitled to a personal opinion (they plainly are) but > whether a chair who publicly endorses ridicule of a participant in an active > dispute can be seen to rule impartially on that participant's draft, and on > any FATT review requests originating from them. RFC 2418 makes working group > chairs accountable to the responsible AD and charges them with managing the > group's business fairly and even-handedly. The impartiality of the chair is > not a personal matter; it is a property of the role, and it is the one thing > the role cannot function without. > > So I am not asking for any sanction, and certainly not for removal. I am > asking you, as the AD who appoints and oversees the chairs, to weigh two > proportionate things: > > 1. Whether the appearance of impartiality has been affected enough that > recusal of the chair concerned from procedural rulings on > draft-usama-tls-risks-of-mlkem (and from any FATT requests originating with > the same author) is warranted, so that those calls are visibly made by > someone with no stake in how the author has been characterized. > > 2. A brief acknowledgment to the group that endorsing personal attacks on > contributors is inconsistent with the neutrality the chair role requires > independent of platform, and without anyone needing to monitor personal > accounts. > > If the chair concerned chose, on her own, to reconsider the public > endorsement, I think that would go a long way toward restoring confidence. > But I take your point that that is hers to decide, not something to be > compelled through the conduct guidelines. > > [1] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tls/hmZH_Rkibo55nS62hQeo3Lx-TqQ/ > > Nadim Kobeissi > Symbolic Software • https://symbolic.software > > _______________________________________________ > TLS mailing list -- [email protected] > To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected] _______________________________________________ TLS mailing list -- [email protected] To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected]
