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Today's Topics:
1. Manual: mistake (Jurgen Kluft)
2. Re: Trom Digest, Vol 103, Issue 12 @ Alberto (Paul Tipon)
3. Re: Trom Digest, Vol 103, Issue 18 (Aarre Peltomaa)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2013 02:23:01 +0000
From: Jurgen Kluft <jurgen_t...@hotmail.com>
To: The Resolution of Mind list <trom@lists.newciv.org>
Subject: [TROM1] Manual: mistake
Message-ID: <col401-eas1247f4bc45fe50b9a0910d395...@phx.gbl>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hi Trommers,
I am reading the manual again ( ? again) and on every sentence I let
the whole thing sink in.
When doing this I came to a possible error and I would like to raise
this point in the manual that, I think, is a (quite serious) mistake.
It is about a passage in the Chapter ?Theory?:
?
The four basic actions of life each have a twin postulate structure:
1.The postulate bringing the effect into existence, and the
postulate that it shall be known.
2.The postulate taking the effect out of existence, and the
postulate that it shall be made not-known.
3.The postulate to know the effect and the postulate that it shall
be made known.
4.The postulate to not-know the effect and the postulate that it
shall be made not-known.
?
The 2nd statement at the end states ?that it shall be made
not-known?. It is of my understanding that the word ?made? should be
removed.
Bringing something into existence equals the postulate ?shall be
made known? or ?make known?.
Taking something out of existence equals the postulate ?shall be
made not known? or ?make not known?.
We can thus abbreviate the above four points:
1. Make known - Know
2. Make not known - Not know
3. Know - Make known (1. from Other)
4. Not know - Make not known (2. from Other)
And that is correct according to the next bullet list in the manual:
?
SELFOTHERS
1. Make known.
2. Make not-known
3. Know.
4. Not-know.Know.
Not-know.
Make known.
Make not-known.
?
Can anyone confirm this?
Thank you.
-Jurgen
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Message: 2
Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2013 20:52:16 -0800
From: Paul Tipon <pti...@proftitleserv.com>
To: trom@lists.newciv.org
Subject: Re: [TROM1] Trom Digest, Vol 103, Issue 12 @ Alberto
Message-ID: <91f7afc5-8558-4f61-8790-d0a29366c...@proftitleserv.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed
Hi Alberto,
This is really great to hear. Well done.
Paul
On Feb 12, 2013, at 4:00 AM, trom-requ...@lists.newciv.org wrote:
Hello to every tromers!
Today i have finished Trom my mind is solved. I have achieved the
voluntary game condition! Is a very natural state! Very simple!
For what I understand is not possible to go in full no game
condition because you have to drop the body! I chose not do that
at this time I want to participate in clearing the planet as a
field Reiki master and have the planet to be clear for every man
and human! The paradise on earth is possible now I know! I can go
in no game condition in any aspect of my life, but I chose not to
do that! The best is let others to play games as they like and
help them to go free of compulsion to play, if I go in full no game
I go out of the multiversity as a spiritual game player, or joy in
to prime creator! I can joy in any moment I want but not for
full! I chose to do the job that is there to be done! So may this
inspire your work in Trom! Do very much RI (all and every
difficulty on Trom comes from lack of RI ON Be, do, have, and
applying every type of postulates of the to Know chart positive and
negative! Do also much RI By touch things and put postulates
together!
This is my experience did the job for me. I did about 500H of
Trom! and 200 of Reiki self therapy, and 100 of meditation, I was
class IV
auditor and level III pc! My life falls all apart during the
process! Everything fully, and I myself as a being, got on full
total failure, on the ton scale for several times! I stand up pick
up my head and go to battle again! I was in the hospital for 1
time, go crazy other one, my mind plaid every game against me at
the end is my best friend! For me big help was Reiki training, and
at the very end meditation on who am I? (Bock keys to ultimate
freedom!)
So here it is it can be done but only for the ones of real courage
and good of hard and will!
You are here to make a difference in the small things life is very
simple like this change your mind and you see the simple of life and
stop to try to make bad influence on it!
So life just flow in harmony! So you are!
Best to every one! If anyone needs help please ask! I do my best!
All my love to all of you!
To God!
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2013 00:20:54 -0500
From: Aarre Peltomaa <peltomaa.aa...@gmail.com>
To: The Resolution of Mind list <trom@lists.newciv.org>
Cc: "Colleen K. Peltomaa" <cygnifi...@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [TROM1] Trom Digest, Vol 103, Issue 18
Message-ID:
<canrdadq9kk4qgjzx3md9tae_r0ujezm0gv2h_cjuyfwo5h+...@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Hi Vladimir,
Thank you for clarifying for the hundredth time what a cross-packaged
postulate set consists of. How can this be so, so, so difficult for the
others to understand ?
It's so, so simple !! The perfect opposition to 'to love' is 'to not be
loved'. The perfect opposition to 'to not love' is 'to be loved'. Two
Complementary and two Opposition postulates are right within the
same four-postulate package which is NOT, NOT, cross-packaged. The
perfect complement of 'to love' is 'to be loved', and the perfect
complement of 'to not love' is 'to not be loved'. How could that be so
damn complicated?
To ask at a baseball game if 'Should I throw the baseball' would be
cross-packaged with 'should I catch the basketball'. One is a baseball,
and one is a basketball. They AREN'T EVEN PLAYING IN THE SAME BUILDING OR
PLAYING THE SAME GAME!! The complement of 'to throw a baseball' is 'to
catch a baseball', not 'to catch a football'. The opposition of 'to
throw a baseball' is 'to not catch a baseball', not 'to not catch a
volleyball'. To find the complement, go sideways/horizontal on the
chart. To find the opposition, go diagonally from top-left to
bottom-right, or from bottom-left to top-right on the chart. To
go vertically/up and down, on the left or right sides of the chart, one
will find the positive or negative, positives on top, and negatives on the
bottom.
The postulate 'to drive a car' is NOT, NOT, NOT the opposition of 'to not
be flown in an airplane'; that is cross-packaged since one is a car, and
the other is an airplane.
There is a more general overall postulate of 'to bring someone somewhere',
or it's opposition of 'to not be brought somewhere', which oversees the
earlier two postulates, but it's still a DIFFERENT postulate, not exactly
the same.
THE TWO PERFECT OPPOSITIONS WITHIN A POSTULATE SET ARE EACH DIAGONAL ON THE
CHART OF A CORRECTLY PACKAGED FOUR-POSTULATE SET. ALL FOUR POSTULATES MUST
BE MATCHED UP TO NOT BE CROSS-PACKAGED; OF COURSE TWO PAIRS WILL BE
OPPOSITIONS, AND TWO PAIRS WITH BE COMPLEMENTS. THERE ARE SIX PAIRS IN A
POSTULATE SET, INCLUDING TWO NEGATIVE/POSITIVE PAIRS.
SIMPLIFIED...
A----------------B COUNT SIX !
- -
- - AB, AC, AD, BC, BD, CD.
- - -
-
- - - -
- - - -
- - - -
- - - -
C----------------D
COMPLEMENTS... A-B, C-D
OPPOSITIONS.......A-D, C-B
NEGATIVE/POSITIVES...
A-C, B-D
Correct ? ! Thanks to Vladimir.
Aarre Peltomaa
On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 4:54 PM, Svoboda Vladimir <captf...@yandex.ru>wrote:
*************
The following message is relayed to you by trom@lists.newciv.org
************
........and my 4 cents:
Bonding and Cross-packaging
I often observe a lot of considerations wich are fotmulated as ''if A,
then B'': If I don't work, then don't survive. I work to survive. Make
money or die.
If I make a package with these goals ( work and survive), it will be the
classical cross-packaging, because these are different goals.
1. Must be survived. 3. Must work
2. Must be not survived. 4. Must'nt work
It's daily madness of somebody.
If I run two separate packages it will be correct and clear.
But what have these goals in common? These goals are methods to know is
the answer.
It is a simple example how to bond different goals. Paul gave more
complicated example of this bonding scenario: "Then there is the mind which
we have all set up and continue to set
up moment by moment as each of us makes the simple postulate ... next
time and from now on I will always ........ or never ......... most
of the time will now ___ when ....... (the old bonding scenario that
Dennis brings up)"
10.02.2013, 16:02, "trom-requ...@lists.newciv.org" <
trom-requ...@lists.newciv.org>:
> Send Trom mailing list submissions to
> trom@lists.newciv.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://lists.newciv.org/mailman/listinfo/trom
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> trom-requ...@lists.newciv.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> trom-ow...@lists.newciv.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Trom digest..."
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Cross Packaging (Pete McLaughlin)
> 2. @ Paul T. RE Postulate Failure Chart @ Colleen (Paul Tipon)
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 9 Feb 2013 14:53:35 -0800 (PST)
> From: Pete McLaughlin <pete_mclaughlin_93...@yahoo.com>
> To: The Resolution of Mind list <trom@lists.newciv.org>
> Subject: Re: [TROM1] Cross Packaging
> Message-ID:
> <1360450415.88677.yahoomail...@web160904.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Hi Roberto
> You got me on that one:
>
> "Thus, a life goal is defined as one which is not opposed to the ?To be
known? leg of the basic package. Thus, a non-life goal is defined as one
which is opposed to the ?To be known? leg of the basic package. Non-life
goals, upon examination, will invariably be found to be part of the
negative legs of life goal packages."
>
> Dennis Stephens. The Resolution of Mind (Kindle Locations 905-909).
tromhelp.com.
>
> by definition there are only life and non life goals.
>
> Sincerely
> Pete
>
>> ________________________________
>> From: "defaul...@gmx.ch" <defaul...@gmx.ch>
>> To: 'The Resolution of Mind list' <trom@lists.newciv.org>
>> Sent: Saturday, February 9, 2013 8:31 AM
>> Subject: Re: [TROM1] Cross Packaging
>>
>> *************
>> The following message is relayed to you by? trom@lists.newciv.org
>> ************
>>
>> Hi Pete
>> ?
>> There aren't three kinds of goal packages as you say.
>> ?
>> I did a search run through the whole manual. The term
>> Cross Packagedoes not exist. Because there is no such
>> thing in the mind. There is only "Cross Packaging",
>> derived from the verb.
>> ?
>> When you try to handle charge contained in Life Goal A by
>> running charge contained in Life Goal B, then you are cross-
>> packaging. There are Life Goals and Non-life Goals, just
>> the two of us.
>> ?
>> Regards
>> Roberto
>> ?
>> ?
>> ?
>> Von:Pete McLaughlin [mailto:pete_mclaughlin_93...@yahoo.com]
>> Gesendet: Sonntag, 27. Januar 2013 22:36
>> An: Brian; TROM
>> Betreff: [TROM1] Cross Packaging
>> ?
>> ?
>> Hi Brian
>> ? One big missing point in the TROM manual is Dennis did not give a lot
of examples of some of the things he was talking about.
>> ?
>> What is in the mind? How do i recognize it and know what to Timebreak?
>> ?
>> There are three kinds of goals packages:
>> The Life Goals which are the To Know goals package and the Junior goals
packages Dennis provided.
>>
>> The Non-life Goals To Hate or to Degrade etc which we avoid.
>>
>> and the Cross Packages which is what the mind is composed of.
>>
>> At level 5 i will work with the postulates of the Life goals packages.
>>
>> Since Dennis made it very important to know and recognize a Life Goals
Package by the relationship between its legs it then is equally important
to know and recognize a the Non-Life Goals and the? Cross Packages so you
will not try and run it at level 5.
>>
>> If we develop skill at formulating and recognizing the three we will do
better at level 5 of TROM.
>>
>> So i am proposing that we use the goals package to formulate both Life
and cross packaged goals and develop our ability to recognize their
differences.
>>
>> This is not a big exercise.? If i can just recognize that putting To Be
Sexed in leg 4 requires that To Not Be Sex go in Leg 3 which is a non
complementary postulate to Leg 1 To Sex proves this is a cross package and
not usable is sufficient.
>>
>> Sincerely
>> Pete ?
>> _______________________________________________
>> Trom mailing list
>> Trom@lists.newciv.org
>> http://lists.newciv.org/mailman/listinfo/trom
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 9 Feb 2013 22:49:17 -0800
> From: Paul Tipon <pti...@proftitleserv.com>
> To: trom@lists.newciv.org
> Subject: [TROM1] @ Paul T. RE Postulate Failure Chart @ Colleen
> Message-ID: <d7f8ff11-8b90-4ae1-a052-e9528ad63...@proftitleserv.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed
>
> On Feb 8, 2013, at 4:00 AM, trom-requ...@lists.newciv.org wrote:
>
>> Subject: [TROM1] @ Paul T. RE Postulate Failure Chart
>>
>> You say:
>> "....That is probably true in general for me too. Simple
>> TimeBreaking is quite sufficient. (Dennis' greatest contribution)
>> I don't see that it is necessary to go thru a complete Postulate
>> Failure Chart. I think one gets a little smarter as well as one
>> does not typically install
>> all 8 possible complementary postulates packages automatically and
>> unconsciously if one is no longer into playing games or stuck in
>> games conditions."
>>
>> I find your statement provocative re the Postulate Failure Chart,
>> and am not sure how to take that. Myself, I see Dennis' greatest
>> contribution IS the PFC.
>>
>> Colleen
>
> I look at it this way. TimeBreaking is the process and the PFC is
> the road map. The PFC was derived from straight forward logic, a
> mathematical recipe which has existed for ages.
>
> TimeBreaking was a new concept for a clearing process that was
> created out of the blue by Dennis. The minute one realizes that they
> are forming a games condition, TimeBreak it don't let it hang and
> then when you fail at letting it hang go on to make another postulate
> leg and another and another until you then have a complete PFC.
> Catch it at the beginning before it goes too far or to a complete PFC.
>
> As time passes one will certainly run into new complete packages and
> even incomplete ones that they still have as I wouldn't think that
> one could possibly catch all the full or partial packages that one
> has ever made since the beginning of time. And when you have pulled
> all the charge available on Level 5, that does not mean that you have
> pulled every package. All that can be said is that you have
> TimeBroken all of the easily available packages. It does not mean
> that every single one of them has been located and TimeBroken. I am
> also sure that there are a multitude more non-life packages than
> there are pro life packages. What needs to happen is that once the
> major PFC items get eliminated to see that one does not still make
> new PFC packages in the future. The question is ... how many times
> have you efforted to be right or efforted to make another wrong or in
> fact did both dramatically and with a lot of effort/energy and
> conviction. How many people go around doing this daily with every
> person they encounter and not know that they are doing this. Maybe
> you are doing many of these just mentally too.
>
> A major part of Level 5 is not to just pull all of the old PFC's that
> are being held together with charge but to not make any new ones.
> Don't get into games conditions and after a while don't even get into
> games without wholly realizing what you are doing and then deciding
> to do it just for the fun or the hell of it and casting that PFC or
> partial PFC off the road and into the ditch when you are done
> deciding to play that particular game any longer.
>
> Then there is the mind which we have all set up and continue to set
> up moment by moment as each of us makes the simple postulate ... next
> time and from now on I will always ........ or never ......... most
> of the time will now ___ when ....... (the old bonding scenario that
> Dennis brings up)
>
> This is why I sign off, Level 5 in progress. I have gotten off the
> easily available packages but certainly not every single one that
> exists for me. I can't see that I have TimeBroken every single PFC
> that I have ever created across a time span of 76 Trillion years.
> I'm sure that there are many many more that are subliminal and have
> very little charge after I put them together and they have remained
> that way if they never became of major concern or importance. This
> is also why I went to Be, Do, Have to scrape as much off as I could,
> Lotta charge or just small charge to very little charge or maybe no
> charge at all but there is still a PFC there.
>
> The Major Ultimate Viewpoint to have:
>
> At some point in time, the object is to start living again without
> unwittingly getting into games and game conditions. That is the real
> goal. The real goal was and is not to just rid one's self of charge
> but to live life effectively with pro-life goals and not be the
> adverse effect of or of having to be the effect of non-life goals.
>
> The goal is to live life as an OT and not attain OT status. That is
> unbelievably hollow and unfulfilling.
>
> Paul, Level 5 in progress
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
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> Trom@lists.newciv.org
> http://lists.newciv.org/mailman/listinfo/trom
>
> End of Trom Digest, Vol 103, Issue 18
> *************************************
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