The following message is relayed to you by  trom@lists.newciv.org
This is a process developed by Mike Wray  of Applied Philosophics  which
was  Dr. Keith Mumby's group in the UK.

I interspersed  some comments in it:

In principle,  I think it is an extremely good and vital  important process.
Although I do not agree with everything in it.

Processing the problems of the mind  is an extremely complex matter and no
one person can figure it all out and perfect it in one lifetime.

Hubbard studied the works of 50,000  yrs of thinking men to develop what he
did  with dianetics and scn.
Dennis Stevens, Mike Wray, Frank Gerbode Zivorad,  and many others did a
lot of work to improve upon what Hubbard did.

The intelligent and competent student always learns every possible from all
those who came before him, and stands on their shoulders to see farther
(or deeper into the subject, as in the case of the problems of the mind).

The biggest room in the world is room for improvement.

Knowledge is not static.

And no one holds a monopoly on knowledge.

I think this process and the comments made,  will be helpful to the TROMMER.

> MUM - 1
> 8 October 1993
> Copyright (C) 1993 Dr. Keith Mumby
> Redistribution rights granted for non commercial purposes.
> ((This is easily one of the most brilliant pieces on clearing
> technology that I have read in a long time. Dr. Mumby is a professional
> doctor, and a clearing practitioner. He is the head of Applied
> Philosophics (AP), Manchester England.))

> Sooner or later you will come across an incident which is central
> to shaping the preclear's experiential track this lifetime. It is
> severely aberrative, very traumatic and often TOTALLY OCCLUDED. It
> holds the preclear in thrall and defines that person's case for life.

> We call it the core incident and you may encounter it as early as the
> first few hours in Life Repair.

*Thrall: To be held under someones power. *
> This type of incident needs a particular handling, developed by AP
> specialist Mike Wray, which is unlike any other type of auditing or
> therapy. The usual method of reducing traumatic incidents simply won't
> work on core incidents. Hence this issue.

> Despite being a current-lifetime event, the core incident is
> completely unconfrontable to the preclear and remains shut off behind a
> wall of pain and extreme overwhelming paralyzing fear.

(Look up what cataplexy and catatonia are on line)

Sometimes the individual doesn't even know it is
> there, much less the likely content. We have learned that cases can be
> audited for years, going on to the whole track and up the transformation
> levels, yet totally fail to come to grips with the core incident.

> We know that whatever is the most unconfrontable is what aberrates
> the most. This means the greatest possible case gain gets missed.


> For obvious reasons, the core incident would normally lie in
> childhood years (though not necessarily). It is shocking, utterly
> bewildering and painfully overwhelming, ((and beyond all
> comprehension)), to the young person's mind. Incidents of sexual abuse
> are often of this type. The event is so awful and frightening, the
> being locks the memory away and makes a postulate

(if so it could also be an unwittingly and unconsciously -unintentionally
made postulate- even wordless postulate) to never EVER look at
> it again.

(Or does not make a postulate, but the incident is just severely
traumatically blocked, or it is an implied -forced- inflicted -postulate by

There does not have to be to be any words or specific thoughts to it,-
there are such things as wordless, thoughtless postulates, possibly just
intention or not even intention. Anything is possible. )

He or she may know it is there (usually not) but cannot even
> remember its content, much less run it to erasure. Yet it cleaves to
> the very heart of the identity they hold in this lifetime.
> Occluded it certainly is, but it is there, spreading its poison.
> It is mocked up and held so obsessively and heavily that it gains a
> powerful auto-hypnotic quality. You could call it an implant, that's
> how intense the thing is. (It is a type of implant, and could be  part of
demon circuits.)
> Like any implant, it will stick the individual emotionally. He or
> she is driven down the tone scale, until being pinned down forcefully at
> the level their resistance is overwhelmed. Thus the incident is
> characterized by intractable unconfrontable rage, fear, grief, despair or
apathy ((or
> all of the above plus more)). The person often  has a fixed tone at this
> level.


*(ɪnˈtræk tə bəl) adj. *

*1. not docile or manageable; stubborn. *

*2. hard to shape or work with: an intractable metal. *

*3. hard to treat, relieve, or cure. *

*intractable* *- not tractable; difficult to manage or mold; "an
intractable disposition"; "intractable pain"; "the most intractable issue
of our era"; "intractable metal" *
> But here's the catch. The secret revealed which will free so many
> sufferers is this:

*> THEIR picture that is being driven in on them so destructively. *

*The> tendency is to mis-own the responsibility and blame the perpetrator
of > the attack.*

[Comment by David Pelly:I don't agree  with Mike Wray on the above point.
It does not even make sense. It is just a carry over of Hubbard's BS data
on responsibility. I think it is because he did not want PCs going to kill
their parents for doing what they did.   These are the kinds of false data
(which become traps)  that Hubbard implanted into scientology, that people
have not questioned.]

This is what locks it up. We know from the mechanics of
> auditing that anything which persists contains a lie (or simply a false

Whereas it is true that the victim had something done to them, the
auto-hypnosis of
> this implant is their own responsibility. This is the ONLY way to
> unlock the door.

> The fact of obsessively making the picture and using it to harm
> their lives is an act of destruction the person does against themselves
> on the first dynamic. This is what destroys their self-respect and
> dignity, because deep down the individual knows the truth. The key to
> lifting this trauma, you will see, is FORGIVENESS FOR SELF, much more so
> than forgiveness for the oppressor.

[Comment by David Pelly: Again, I don't fully agree with the above.)

> It is apparent that sexual abuse is widespread in our society.
> Molestation and hurt of children has been described as the flaming
> danger signal that any civilization is on its way out.


To my knowledge, primitive people do not engage in this particular

> Adults who practice a wide variety of adventurous sexual activity> find
it difficult to come to terms with these acts.

*D> All of our problems are due to unGodly sexual practices and unGodly
lifestyle practices.*

*Garbage in- garbage out.*

*Good stuff in- good stuff out. *

*I have a hypothesis (for at least one reason) on why some people are
assholes and have shit for brains, are backwards (are insane: that is;
can’t tell right from wrong) : :Their mothers were impregnated from behind.*

*Oral sex, eventually causes a person to act and think like they are fucked
in the head. *

*Because the respective chakras are contaminated and corrupted,  and
corrupt the physical body and mind.*

*In one of his books, I forget which one, Hubbard says (something to the
effect, I cannot remember his words exactly)  that perverted sexual
practices  and abuse of sex will cause so much damage to the person  in
later yrs, that it will be a price that no one will be willing to pay.*

*People who commit perverted sexual practices or abuse sex, including
masturbation over time, develop discordant energy fields. Even repellent
energy fields. Energy field is uncomfortable to be in. *

*Breach of sanctioned sexual function  is breach of natural law, breach of
natural law and order, breach of common sense, breach of the laws of  right
and wrong.*

It is hard to understand just how shocking a rape may be to an innocent
child who
> encounters nudity and sex for the first time. Often it is not the
> sexuality of the incident but the FORCE and FEAR that harms. Children
> who are lured or teased into depraved acts probably do not suffer so
> much. But the unfortunates who are held down physically and violated
> can be crushed utterly as beings. The betrayal and mystification is all
> the worse to them because it comes from parents or close family members
> who are, or should be, symbols of comfort and safety. The only solution
> they have to the agony is to shut it off completely and refuse to think
> about it.
> The occlusion is made worse by the fact that the abuser will
> usually add orders to keep quiet with such aberrative commands as "If
> you tell anyone about this, I'll kill/thrash you/lock you in a cupboard
> forever...etc", which only adds further to the inaccessibility.
> This is what you are up against as an auditor.

[David Pelly: It could be even just thoughts and intentions, that are
pounded in.]

> It isn't all sexual, of course. A child can live a life of terror
> due to frequent physical beatings which over the years becomes gradually
> locked up as a lengthy core incident, even when the beatings cease. The
> social welfare care of children is far from effective and cases
> constantly surface in the press showing just what some youngsters have
> to endure before anyone tries to call a halt.
*Some are treated worse > than animals* and indeed there have been a number
of deaths due to
> starvation and abuse.

*D> That reads as if animals are supposed to be treated bad  to some

*In the old days some people out of ignorance or insanity  treated animals
very badly. *

*My dad did this to his cows. Nothing would go right for my dad. He would
beat his cows and sic the dogs after the cows and use force to make the
cows do what he wanted them to do.*

*My mom would come and fix up an unmanageable, chaotic  situation which was
going on for  hours  for my dad,  and fix it peacefully  in a few minutes,
much of it just by her presence. *

> To make matters worse, some of the support institutions mete out
> the worst imaginable treatment of youngsters taken into their care. The
> so-called "pin-down" tortures in Staffordshire children's homes which
> came to light in 1987 is an example of the way children may be treated
> as sub-human by adult bullies and perverts who call themselves "social
> workers".

*D> Note my experience with the John Howard society. *

*A few yrs after I learned about dianetics and scn, (about 98 or 99 or
2000) I felt so bad for all the juvenile delinquent children being punished
by the courts and put in jail.*

*So I went to apply for a counselors job at the John Howard Society.*

*I had to write an exam and then was interviewed by the head of staff- a

*I was asked if I thought that it  was the child that was the problem, or
was it the parents who were the problem?*

*I said: It was the parents who were the problem. *

*The staff head  boiled over on the spot, she turned very red and  went
into subdued, suppressed rage.*

*And pretty much threw me out.*

 ((Another kind of core incident is simple repeated starvation from> not
being fed over and over again when one is hungry.

*D> Yes, then when the child does get to eat, he over eats just in case he
does not get to eat again for sometime. Also eats for emotional comfort.*

*And develops eating disorders and obesity. *

Or the baby is
> ignored when it cries and the mother comes only when it has given up and
> gone into silence and life apathy about anyone ever coming. The mother
> worries when the baby is NOT wailing! This long term abuse ruins the
> very core of the child's being, and is almost impossible to audit, as
> the child is in a long term repeated near death engram, that may have
> happened thousands of times.))
> The older a person gets, the more the optimism and vitality of
> youth erodes and the more this incident comes to dominate the psyche.
> Life, after all, will constantly hammer them up against the hidden
> memory. It is part of almost every mental computation - a true "held
> down seven". Sometimes a key-in will mark a major set-back in life.
> For many it is downhill from there.

> This is the stuff of psychotic breaks and many cases live VERY

> close to the edge with this. It colours all the person's thinking and
> destroys their self-esteem. Some cases simply loath themselves and what
> they have become. Because of the self-implant effect, the individual
> goes about with this nightmare twisting every perception and attitude in
> life. Often the person is so far out of valence, he or she will bewail
> being "somebody else" or "not being me".

Family or spouses can come in for harsh accusation for supposedly
preventing the victim from being
  able "to do what they want",

when all the time it is the implant

*D> (or other aberrating factors as in axiom 138)*

that is in control.  The "forget and move on psychologies", such as using
> linguistic programming to rewrite a person's reality is VERY dangerous
> for these people.

The monster can unleash its violence at any moment
> when the combination of circumstances are right, with greatly
> detrimental consequences. (Mass murderers and terrorists)

Pretending it isn't there is exactly what is
> wrong with the person's life. Do NOT fall for this in therapy.

> The difficulty with core incidents is getting at them to run. They
> are so buried that the auditor may miss them on routine case procedures.
> It is vital, therefore, to maintain a high index of suspicion.
> Important warning signs are fixed tone, no case gain, little or no
> TA action, the case doesn't run well, despair in auditing and the
> preclear out of valence. The TA will often be high and the needle
> stuck. Or after apparently good sessions, the preclear keeps coming
> back with a reading mental mass in restimulation.
> The really diagnostic signs, however are as follows:
> a sense of loneliness and isolation lack of self worth, no self confidence

or self esteem, rejection desperation, the feeling of being to blame

> These are persistent attitudes that come up endlessly on the case.

> No amount of auditing seems to shift them. Nothing AS-ISes. The case
> may be virtually unrunnable if this is the situation, until the core
> incident is found and addressed.
> On no account try to put people with these manifestations onto more
> advanced transformations. They will simply become over-restimulated and
> may go into a permanent decline. The anguish and sense of failure seems
> to intensify, the more the hidden memory is skirted around.
* After all, > the being knows it is there* and understands only too well
the shame of
> being unable (unwilling) to view it.

*D> That does not ring true to me. I question if : "the being knows it is

*He may sense that something is wrong, but can't figure out what it is.*

> ((The subject of why victims feel guilty or shamed of themselves is
> a hot and controversial one, but the fact is one of the fastest roads
> into the withheld motivator of this life IS guilt and shame. There will
> be overts after the incident, they won't be able to live up to their
> fair chosen duties and so on, there will be overts IN the incident as
> they try to strike back with all the intention they can,

*D> (That is only true if they are old enough or big enough or strong
enough to fight back?   Or if all the natural fight in them has not been
pounded out of them in one way or another, they can fight back. But if the
fight in them has been beat out of them, then he can't fight back. *

*See bk 1. *

*My case is very similar to what is described in bk 1 edition 1992 soft
cover, on page 125 and 126 , and 213 and 214.*

*Quote paraphrased: The value of a child who is forced to succumb to
punishment is so slight that the Spartans would long since have drown him. *

*He is made useless by having his will, spirit  and self determination
broken, and self confidence, self worth, self respect, self esteem is
totally destroyed.*

*He will break everything for his parent.*

*He will be  a total loser.*

*He was prevented from being, prevented from doing, prevented from having.*

Condition is:

*Must be- can't be.*

*Must do- can't do.*

*Must have- can't have.*

and there may

> be co-excused withheld overts before the incident in past lives when
> they did to their children what was done to them in this life. All
> these trails of guilt must be taken up in order to get at the anger in
> this life that is killing the person. The person is actually killing
> themselves WITH the incident in order to stay alive THROUGH the
> incident! There will be such a computation in the incident that must be
> gotten off for the the thing to fully erase.))

*D> This does not ring true to me. I question the validity of past lives,
for myself anyways. *

*What little past life auditing I have had has not worked in my opinion or
my experience.*

*I think this past life idea is a persistent Hubbard's BS trap.*

*He diabolically and cleverly gives you a case and past lives to audit  to
send you on a wild bird chase to draw as much money out of you as possible.*

*And devotees and sheeple and robots  are parroting Hubbard. *

*Hubbard covertly implants his case in the PC and when it is audited out,
the PC gets a win of sorts, but it is a clearing of what was implanted by

*That is my hypothesis.*

*Another hypothesis is that when you are auditing past lives and getting
answers, you could be actually comming with some type of BTs, who are
playing tricks. *

*Anything is possible.*

*I have read from a couple of sources that there are plus or minus 20
different types of humans on this planet and some may be new beings and
some may be reincarnated beings.*

*The main point to keep in mind, is what is true for the individual is true
for the individual. *

*Nothing else should be suggested in any way shape or form. *

> The worst cases you may have to deal with are people who have
> slicked over the core incident in other therapies, which bury it further
> in evaluation and glibness. The individual you may find has been made
> to rationalize their experiences; made into a confirmed "victim" by
> misdirected sympathy; bounced off the engram repeatedly and generally
> made even more fearful or helpless in the face of its charge.

*D> That rings true to me.*

> The whole key to the case is to locate and reduce the core
> incident. Yet there is total somatic shut-off and no recall. How to
> proceed?
> Firstly, any light auditing which gets off charge is valid. Life
> repair entry is excellent at unburdening. Gradually, the individual's
> confront is increased so that they understand the nature of mental
> facsimilies and how to deal with them.
> The existence of a core incident may become apparent, or the
> auditor may begin to suspect one. As you learn more about the
> individual's early life, the possibility of such an event may be
> obvious. Be on the look out. You may be suspicious, due to the
> character of the parents and immediate family members and the
> relationship of each to your case. Abuse incidents do not tend to take
> place in loving balanced homes.

*D> This is significant.*

  *yes, it is important to compare what you have been  taught in scn, with
what you see in the outside world.*

*(This is taught in ch 20;  How to study a science;  in;  A New slant on
life. ) *

*Look at all the sane and functional families and very able people who have
never done scn. They are doing quite well.*

*If having a fucked up past life track was true, as scngists have been
programmed with, everyone in the world would be fucked up dysfunctional. *

*(Be at or near the bottom of the tone scale.)*

*But that is not so. There are lots of very high toned, high theta able
people in the world. Lots of great loving families. *

*Scntlgy has lots of diabolically placed /embedded lies, traps and false
and limiting data, that has never been inspected or evaluated by the very
large majority of people who did scngy.*

*The most dangerous lies (or false datums) are the ones that are embedded
in mental constructs which contain enough truth to hide them. The more
truth there is in a mental construct, the more the truth acts as a glue to
hold the embedded lie in place. Then they are not inspected and often
defended to death.*

Question and test everything.

> If it is not discreditable ((a discreditable incident like sexual
> abuse which the perpetrator is trying to hide)), such as an accident or
> operation leading to an NED (near death experience), it is possible the
> preclear may even have been told what happened conceptually. Thus the
> core incident can be fully described but he or she, of course, would
> have no direct access via recall.

> ((It may be that there is a train of incidents that the parent does
> not consider discreditable but also has little inkling of the damage
> they cause, so they talk about them a lot even though they were deadly.
> 'Oh you used to cry and cry, and we just ignored you, you were such a
> noise maker, we thought you would drive us nuts, but eventually you
> quieted down. You were such a nice baby.'))

*D> Oh boy! Good example!*

> The way to get into these heavy incidents is the technique of
*> "feeling repeater",* as described in Life repair Series No. 8.

*D> > "feeling repeater", I never heard this phrase before. That is a good

We find
> and work on the crucial feeling, sensation, emotion, attitude or pain
> that characterizes the incident and let it drift us down into the
> depths.
> Once sonic or visio gets turned on, it is easier. More and more of
> it comes into view; the preclear bounces out but you keep thrusting them
> back in by focusing on the feeling - all the time the feeling or
> attitude etc. You can keep breaking off chunks. The file clerk offers
> a somatic or image but will seem to snatch it away again straight away;
> it becomes re-buried. Great patience is needed: 10 - 20 hours on JUST
> ONE INCIDENT is not uncommon.

> With a psychometer, of course, it is much easier. This will read
> on charge in the pre-conscious area, just below awareness. The auditor
> guides with "What was that?" as he follows the reads and digs it out,
> bit by bit. When nothing is moving, a key phrase such as "I can never
> forgive myself" or "This is hopeless" will read well and you can keep
> bringing the preclear back to this over and over.
> You have to get at how the incident affected THEM, the way it is
> used as a filter on reality and perception. How does he or she THINK
> about this incident? The sense of being to blame or the sheer
> unconfrontability often thrusts the person into a different valence and
> he or she will not see it from their own viewpoint - WHICH OF COURSE IS
> It is said that 80% of life is how you take it and 20% is how you
> make it. You need to keep asking "How did you take to/respond to that"
> at each stage, over and over.
> Mike Wray calls this the interface. The preclear is controlled via
> what they believe about the memory and its consequences. This brings us
> back to the self-hypnotism effect. To those of you who know your
> transformational grade material, it acts rather like a service
> facsimile, as described by L. Ron Hubbard, circa 1951.
> ((The service facsimile is that incident the preclear uses to
> excuse his failures, and has a computation at its core of the form, 'The
> way to get disabled is to be able, so the way to remain able is to be
> disabled.

*These are called Safe Solutions because they help the being > deal with
Dangerous Problems, but really they are Dangerous Solutions >*
*because they are an attempt to handle a Dangerous Problem by being >
dangerous to oneself.))*

*D> This data or a part of it, (the idea that a being is responsible for
his case or any part of it, does not ring true for me.*

*Axiom 138 rings true for me. All other VPs get stuck in my internal gut
meter. *

* > *
> It is something the person uses to explain failures in survival.
> It has come to be USEFUL to that person, at some crazy computation
> level.

*D> I think Hubbard;s def of cerfac is wrong.*

*The computation was a matter of necessity, a matter of survival. The least
of the evils or and  having no other workable option. *

*All available flows or options were blocked.*

*The parent sometimes does this so the child does not become smarter than
the parent, and see and expose the parents faults or harmful acts or crimes
or "one up"  the parent, or get one over the parent. *

*That is what rings true for me.*

*That is true suppression or the ultimate suppression or the worst kind of
suppression. *

At the very least, it is a definitive (prescriptive) view of
> reality for them. ((Prescribe means to set down a rule

D> *(or the only workable  course of action)*

about how one
> should live to be safe, happy or able.))
> One of the major feelings to prevent running of CIs is the utter
> disbelief of the case. The person has a hard time accepting the truth
> of what they recover as memory. It may be weeks ((or in my case years))
> after successfully exploding the core incident that the person actually
> dares to believe it may have been true.

*D> I like that Mike Wray  admitted talking about his own case. *

*It adds a tremendous amount of credibility.*

> ((Core incidents often restimulate whole track and magic track, also
> one's own overts along those lines. It is often a Withheld Motivator
> sitting on top of a Co-excused Overt in a past life. Thus there is
> tremendous incredibility on the incident, much of which comes from what
> is RESTIMULATED AT THE TIME OF THE INCIDENT independent of the incident
> itself.))
> Another is the tendency to give up. The person will often cry in
> anguish that "Nothing can be done. It's hopeless. I'm done for."

*D> Could I add: ........ “I can't handle it.” ? *

> These can be terrible emotions for the auditor to have to confront and
> you need to be in good personal shape. But you can also use these for
> repeaters and this may plunge you quickly into the heart of the
> incident.
> Unconsciousness may surface and be reflected as falling into a
> stupor while running.

*D> Or a lot of other incredible and scary stuff. *

Just keep going. It will boil off.

> One of the most striking manifestations, says Mike Wray, is that the
> individual seems UTTERLY BLIND. They just cannot see what they have
> been doing that has been so ruinous, if you can imagine a person blind
> at the level of beingness. The bewilderment persists and the auditor
> may need to lead evaluatively by clever guidance, such as "Can you see
> how this would lead to...etc?" It is important to use only hypothetical
> examples and show them on some "imaginary case" how if THAT occurred and
> then THAT, the result would surely be...(whatever has happened to them).
> Slowly, chunk by chunk, it surrenders.
> After you have run the incident through plenty of times, take a
> pause to review things. Asking: "Let's take stock; how does this
> incident seem to you now?" will update you on the PC's tone and
> awareness. You have got some charge off an incident which was clearly
> shameful or hurtful. Ask: "How do you feel now about yourself after
> having gone through all that?" He or she will probably not be feeling
> very positive about themselves. Also you want to know: "How do you feel
> now about this other person in the incident?" You will usually get a
> charged up response, such as "bastard".

*D> That is being nice.*


> If this is the attitude, you say: "I take it that it would still be
> very difficult to forgive that person fully for what happened?" which
> will probably read. Explain that you want to really purge or cleanse
> the thing fully out of the person. Tell the preclear you can see there
> is still some deep seated anger and ask him or her to GET THE IDEA, IN

*D>  How about getting the pc to "be"  the perpetrator (to be in the
perpetrators shoes) and then audit the perpetrator on necessary or relevant
flows? *

> With luck, that will blow down and you will get a floating needle
> and suitable realizations and smiles to end off. The preclear will have
> fully AS-ISed the incident and all its pain and be freed finally by that
> last act of forgiveness.
> But more likely at first, they will try, yet be fairly non-
> committal. You may need to ask: "How did that go?" after they have
> worked at it for a few minutes. The reply is usually "I don't know" or
> something like that. It is obvious they haven't forgiven anything. So
> say: "When I asked you to do that, what feeling did you bump into?". It
> will start reading and you can call "That..that.." till they tell you
> what it was - irritation, grief or whatever emotion turns on.
> Then you go back to repeater feelings, using this new emotion that
> has surfaced. "We need to confront that emotion if you are going to be
> able to get free of this fully and erase it altogether. Where do you
> get that feeling inside? Now really confront it..." and you are away
> running it again.
> Some new material might come up. You re-scan it over and over, TIR
> ((Traumatic Incident Reduction)) style, till that too all erases.

> Then you go back to: "How do you feel about this incident now?" and
> so on, back to forgiveness, round and round, till it is GONE forever.

> You can tell from what has been run if the person has guilt and
> self-punishment. Shame, blame or regret means they are still beating
> themselves up about it in some way.

*You must also ask:*

*"How do you feel about forgiving yourself for getting into this situation
in the first   place?* How does that feel to you?"

*Probably there will be doubt or > resistance to this. Tell him or her to:
"Get the idea of completely > 100% absolving yourself or all guilt, all
blame". Watch for a read and > ask "What's that?" Get off the negative
emotions as above. Do the same > thing agai*n.

*D> This irks me. It reads on my internal meter.*

*t does not ring true for me. *

*You are evaluating for the preclear. *

*You are telling him what his “case” is. *

*Or you are putting someone else's “case” or “data” into him.*

*IMO this is very wrong. *

*You need to have the pc figure out what his case is for himself.*

* As I mentioned above, it is hating self and blaming self that locks >
these up at core. *

*D> Mike Wray contradict's himself from what he said earlier. *

You must go down far to get this. You are gouging
> out stuff pretty deeply from the soul at this point. Eventually all the
> negativity will come out, the charge blow and the meter go free needle.
> Up it comes and sooner or later he or she will recognize they no longer
> feel guilt, no blame, no hurt...it's shiny and clean and NO PERSISTENCE
> (see definition of AS-ISness).
> You cannot free the being fully until you have achieved this.

*The hurt will linger slightly, the sense of being somehow a "victim",
which > is where most therapies squarely place the unlucky case.*

*D> The above is in contradiction of axiom 138. *

*> ((The whole theory of Co-excused withholds comes into play here on >
Core Incidents. The being receives an overwhelming incident in this > life
that makes them want to kill or ruin the perpetrator WHILE the > incident
is going on. An effort to strike out and harm the opponent is > generated
at the height of the incident, but it scuttled in mid stroke > by a sudden
rememberance of a prior guilt. If the being strikes out to > 'teach the
perpetrator a lesson' now, that means THEY deserve the same > treatment for
what they did life times ago to their own children.*

*D> This does not ring true to me. Axiom 138 rings true for me. *

>My experience is that this past life is BS.

> There is little satisfaction to having killed your tormentor if you
> now have to go turn yourself in to receive a similar execution for a
> prior deed which has until now remained conveniently hidden. It is
> during these moments of High Injustice that the being's craving for
> Absolute Justice comes once again to the surface, but as he prepares to
> deliver the death blow, he remembers he has one coming to him too. So
> he sheepishly changes his mind IN MID STROKE and kind of shrinks back
> into his suffering, lest anyone be reminded of his own misdeeds.
> Any thetan in any baby body can kill any parent dead by merely
> throwing a bolt at him.

*D> This does not ring true for me. *

*How can any  thetan in any baby body kill any parent dead by merely
throwing a bolt at him? *

*I think this is just parroting more of Hubbard's style of BS.*

*I think this (having adopted such BS as true)  is one reason why every
scngist I have met, after many yrs of auditing, is still a mess. *

*And since then having a poor grip on right and wrong. And having quite low
ability. *

*In my peak states that I have attained from auditing, I was almost all
knowing, and extremely powerful. So much that I was afraid to use it.  I
did not have enough time to get used to it and learn how to use it and
learn how to stay in that state. *

*SPs and overts and ignorance caved me in. *

That he doesn't and throws the bolt at himself
> instead is a sure sign of a Co-excused Overt / Withheld Motivator lock
> up.

*D> I repeat my previous statement about axiom 138 being true, at least for

> Later he ends up holding onto the present Injustice more out of a
> desire to prove that he DIDN'T strike back and what such a good fellow
> he is and all to suffer all this outrageous treatment so magnanimously,
> so that when others finally find out what HE did many life times ago,
> they will treat him with the same forbearance. If he is still worried
> about consequences of his own past actions being found out, NOTHING will
> get him to give up the present motivator.))

*1. D> Again I question the validity of all the above. *

*I think if one thetan did it many life times ago, than all have done so
too. *

*And if all have done so, then everybody would be similarly fucked up,
which is not the case. Many people are operating a very high level of
ability and personal ethics.*

*2. D> At least I would never or even hint at, or install covertly by
leading questions or implications or insinuations or manipulations or
anything of such nature, in any way shape or form, tell a PC what his case
is or should be or might be.*

*To me that is criminal auditing. *

*It makes me sick.*

*If such data does indeed exist, then let the PC find out for himself.*

*On the other hand, if this is true for someone, than so be it.*

*I do not feel it is true for me.*

*Like I said before, if it is true for me, I want to find out on my own,
without being told what it is, in any way shape or form.*


> You may FN an incident fully and yet you find the preclear still
> slightly hung up, or the auditor gets the sense that there is something
> still there. Many possible flows and feelings exist. Top AP auditors,
> from their wide understanding of the mechanics of the mind, particularly
> "buttons", can pick up extra charge, such as RESPONSIBILITY, SUPPRESSION
> and ADMIRATION. The preclear will be aware of this at some level and
> happily co-operate in releasing the last shreds of charge.

*Perhaps the preclear is still feeling blameworthy. Get the person > to
look up the definition of RESPONSIBILITY so they can see it is > different
from shame, blame and regret. Sometimes even clearing the > definition
blows it totally. The person realizes they had a false > concept of
responsibility, which in AP means CAUSE, it does not mean > "fault".
((Fault means something you did that you didn't mean to do, >
responsibility means knowing willing cause.))*

*D> The above does not ring true for me. *

*The PC may not have been responsible for his case, but he is responsible
for getting it resolved or audited out, he is responsible for dealing with

> In a more established case, incidentally, you can run any heavy
> incident on this responsibility idea.

*Once a certain level of awareness > is reached, the being knows that he or
she is at cause over every part > of experience and reality.*

*D> I think this is just more parroting of Hubbard's BS.*

*> > Similarly, you word-clear the meaning of SUPPRESSION: HARMFUL >
often light up the person's awareness and you can re-run it all, lifting >
the button.*

*D> This contradicts the points above. This rings true for me*
> Once the person understands the mechanism of suppression, they
> begin to realize just how "reasonable" they may have been for years
> about the onslaught of events, or a certain person in particular. It
> may have become chronically instilled into a person to be "nice", even
> when someone has intentions to harm them. It can be a great relief to
> waken up to what was happening and quite therapeutic to let out some
> anger, rather than bottling it all up! Forgiveness isn't what is wanted
> for suppression: it's reverting to being at *CAUSE *with that individual's
> influence.

*D> I question the above underlined ..........CAUSE ? *


* This again is a question of teaching the person to confront. It is >
usual to have a low confront of evil and assume people are OK, when > quite
clearly they are not (see AP 000, the Stressful Personality). By > being
reasonable during auditing, the case may miss half the charge or > more.
Incidentally, "reasonable" too, has a special meaning in AP: it > means
putting up with, accepting and even explaining away things that > are
WRONG. Clearly nothing will improve without the recognition that a >
condition is non-optimum and so reasonableness is a condemnation to >

> Basically, this is "hands on" case handling. You don't program a
> case "in the chair" but you sure had better be able to think on your
> feet. There is no substitute for FULL AND COMPLETE UNDERSTANDING OF THE
> experienced auditor will then know that much bigger wins are sometimes
> available to the preclear and not end off at the first round of end-
> phenomena.
> Finally, I want to mention ADMIRATION as a button. We are
> currently still checking this one out. The idea comes from the early
> 1950's writings of L. Ron Hubbard. According to him, anything which is
> not fully admired tends to persist. He was talking here of concepts at
> the junction between psychology and the metaphysical. This is really
> what the spirit or being is doing. What little investigation we have
> done to date shows that by fully admiring a bad experience, the people
> in it, one's self and one's reaction to it, it will simply dissolve.
> But run it and get the main charge off first. This is for really tough
> core implants.
> Think of it like clearing up a mess in the parlour. You carry off
> all the rubble and sweep up: admiration processing will get rid of the
> nasty stain on the carpet! Look out for a future issue on this.

*D> IMO in this case, admire means “to as-is”. *

*The right word to use is to fully and impartially and honestly and
thoroughly look at it.*

*To see it as it is.*

*To as-is it.*

> Dr. Keith Mumby
> Applied Philosophics
> PO Box 38
> Chorlton
> Manchester M21 1JL
> Tel/Fax: + 44 61 881 1167

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