DAVEH wrote: > That is why I found Phillip's 'translation' so interesting. He said > ".......what is the point of YOU being baptised for the dead by > proxy? Why should YOU be baptised for dead bodies?" > > .........Phillips obviously quoted Paul as though he were speaking > to the Christian Corinthians and it was they who were practicing > baptism for the dead.......which implies that they (Christian > Corinthians) considered baptism a necessary part of their > salvation.
Dave, my friend, I have to watch you like a hawk with regard to your quotes. :-) J.B. Philips did not say what you wrote above. Philips wrote, " ... what is the point of SOME OF YOU being baptised ..." As I had mentioned to you before, Philips was very liberal in how he translated the text. Literally, in the Greek, it is third person plural, and so ought to be translated "they," but Philips took liberty to say "SOME OF YOU" which kind of carries the same thing as saying "THEY." I can only guess that he thought it read better that way. Nevertheless, please understand that just saying "YOU" as you quoted above would be way too much of a stretch, and not even J.B. Philips translated the text that way. I have examined a few Greek texts and noticed that Nestle-Aland's text, the Greek Bible that most modern translations are based upon, differs in this verse from the Textus Receptus, substituting a pronoun for a noun. Nestle-Aland's text says something like "on behalf of them" rather than "on behalf of the dead." In any case, please notice that J.B. Philip's translation does NOT support the notion that the Corinthians as a whole practiced baptism for the dead. It is possible that some of the Corinthians did so, and it is also possible that it was another group altogether with whom the Corinthians were familiar. I have no big problem accepting the idea that some Corinthians held baptism to be this important. Many Christians today, such as Mormons and Church of Christ and the Jesus Name Only group, etc., have similar convictions about baptism. There are some other Christians today who argue that Paul never baptized people as this was primarily a Jewish ritual that hung over into Christianity but was not really necessary for Christian. Neither of these positions are considered orthodox, but they are recognized as being the views of some Christians. DAVEH: > Justified or not, it is evidence that some of the early Christians > believed in the necessity of baptism for salvation much more > than do most current day Christians. What does that mean, "more than do most current day Christians"? We do not know if there were more primitive Christians or less primitive Christians with this emphasis than there are today. I think you read the passage with the bias that most all the Corinthians believed it, and therefore, most all Christianity practiced baptism for the dead. That is a stretch, going beyond what the text supports. You wrote just 10 minutes earlier the following to Laura: DaveH wrote: > "...as it seems unlikely to me that the early Christians wouldn't > have practiced baptism for the dead IF they did not think > baptism was an essential element of salvation. Do you see how to me you said "some of the early Christians" but to Laura you wrote, "the early Christians"? Let's be clear that it was not THE early Christians, but rather POSSIBLY SOME of the early Christians who practiced this superstition of baptizing for the dead. As I said in a past post, I might say to someone in arguing about the validity of the idea of a resurrection, "why do the Egyptians mummify their dead and build pyramids and shrines to them, and bury them with their wealth, if the dead rise not." I might say something about the necessity of blood sacrifice to deal with sin by saying, "why do the Jews sacrifice a pure lamb, and why do pagan's sacrifice their virgin daughters, if the sacrifice of blood to atone for sin was not a valid concept"? None of these kinds of statements are meant to justify an action, but to show that there is an innate conscience that tells us that the resurrection and judgment is coming. Peace be with you. David Miller. ---------- "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
