Slade wrote (April 4, 2003): > I have heard you say a couple of times that Marlin > compared present day Christians to Hitler. Then for > weeks refused to condemn Hitler. Now, it's my belief > that the two or three witness must be different mouths > (which means your two posts do not qualify as two > witnesses... only one) and I haven't heard Marlin admit > to this; nor have I heard anyone back your claim. > Could you go back through your archives and publish his > post for me so I can see it in context?
Glenn wrote (April 4, 2003): > Now, my conclusion is this: if Marlin wouldn't take > a stand against Hitler for a long time, then I have > to conclude one of two things. > 1. He secretly backs him. Or > 2. He doesn't know much about Hitler. > If this is true, Marlin is not to be taken seriously. > He make an idiot comparsion of Christians and Hitler. Slade, My take on the discussion is that Glenn & Marlin have different definitions of the word "Christian" and basically misunderstand one another. I was actually stronger than Marlin in saying that Adolf Hitler was a Christian. By Christian, I mean that he professed a faith in Jesus Christ and was a member of a Christian Church, namely, he was Roman Catholic. At the time of his rise to power, the Catholic Church and many Protestant churches supported him, much like this same group protests the war in Iraq right now. However, this does not mean that Adolf Hitler was a true follower of Jesus Christ. I believe that Hitler's destiny is the same as Satan, the lake of fire. You see, I have no problem saying that most Christians are going to hell. I do not see the word "Christian" as defining anything with truly following Christ. The word "Christian" defines a religious system which attempts to follow Christ, but there are so many sects within Christianity, and not all of them truly walk in his doctrine. Following is an extract of some of the posts from December 2002 when this discussion took place. Note that this only represents what I considered to be relevant excerpts from the discussion and not the total discussion. For example, there was a lot of flaming going on, and I don't consider that part relevant. I think if you read the posts, you will see that Marlin does not think Hitler was a good guy. Rather, Marlin thinks Hitler was a bad Christian. Marlin wrote (Dec. 16, 2002): > So, are you saying Adolph H. = Joseph S.? > Wasn't Adolph a "Christian"? Glenn wrote (Dec. 16, 2002): > You asked if Hitler was a "Christian" with > parentheses around Christian. Do you believe > Hitler was a Christian? Marlin, could you > please explain your question? Marlin wrote (Dec. 16, 2002): > My understanding is that he thought he was God's > servant to usher in the new millennium. > Hitler wrote: "I believe that I am acting in accordance > with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending > myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of > the Lord.." > > "To deny the influence of Christianity on Hitler and > its role in World War II, means that you must ignore > history and bar yourself forever from understanding > how this atrocity occurred." > http://www.nobeliefs.com/Hitler1.htm > > Hope this helps. Glenn wrote (Dec. 17, 2002): > You only half answered my question. Do you think > Hitler was a Christian? What do you think of Hitler? Marlin wrote (Dec. 17, 2002): > What is a Christian? Glenn wrote (Dec. 18, 2002): > I am still waiting for Marlin to tell me what he > thinks of Hitler. Marlin, you made the comment that > Hitler claimed he was influenced by Christianity. > Do you believe Hitler was a Christian? What is your > opinion of Hitler? Marlin wrote (Dec. 18, 2002): > I have already answered you. > ... > I don't think of him. > Check past email. Do your own research. > Glenn asked: "Do you believe Hitler was a Christian?" > Marlin answers: How many denominations are there? > I do not believe he was actually following Christ, > if that is what you mean. Most "Christians" follow > their own ideas. > Glenn asked: "What is your opinion of Hitler?" > Marlin answers: Another nicolaitan. Glenn wrote (Dec. 19, 2002): > Marlin refused to answer Glenn's question. > I am still waiting for Marlin to tell me what > he thinks of Hitler. Marlin, you made the comment > that Hitler claimed he was influenced by Christianity. > Do you believe Hitler was a Christian? What is your > opinion of Hitler? Marlin wrote (Dec. 19, 2002): > You already have your answer. > REV 2:7 {He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit > saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give > to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the > paradise of God.} Glenn wrote (Dec. 19, 2002): > If I misquote you then it's your fault for playing games. > I take it you think Hitler was a good guy. Marlin wrote (Dec. 19, 2002): > I think Hitler may have fit himself into > one of the protestant branches. > http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_deno.htm > If Hitler was a "Christian," then HOW CAN i BE? Marlin wrote (Dec. 19, 2002): > Don't you have any sinners worse than Hitler > to compare me with? Let's see your list grow. > Let's see. Now you have me pegged as a judaiser > who supports Hitler! What else can you dream up? Glenn wrote (Dec. 20, 2002): > You teach people must observe the Old Testament Sabbath > in order to be right with God. You are a Judiazer. > Gal. 5:4. You are condemned in the book of Galatians. > You can't refute Gal. 5:4. > > You compare Hitler to Southern Baptists. You compare > "Jesus Loves You Striptease" to the birth of Christ. > Who are you Marlin? This is utter nonsense. > Here is the truth. You are slow to condemn Hitler. > You're going to have to eventually condemn him to save face. > But what do you really think of Hitler? Marlin wrote (Dec. 20, 2002): > "This is what Marlin teaches...."--Glenn > Correction. This is what Glenn wants to say Marlin teaches. > I do not know how this incessant accuser of the brethren can > make up something in his own imagination and speak it as though > it is true and begin to accuse others of his imaginations. Such > prevarication is beyond me. Glenn wrote (Dec. 20, 2002): > Ask me what I think of Hitler. > It won't take me a month to respond. Marlin wrote (Dec. 20, 2002): > Dear Glenn, > So. Did your God tell you that I support both > Hitler and Judaism? Glenn wrote (Dec. 20, 2002): > Marlin, what are your beliefs concerning Hitler? Marlin wrote (Dec. 20, 2002): > Some of your tactics remind me of his. > I think you have a lot in common with him. > He loved to have control over others. > He ranted and raved when he did not get his way. > He demonized those who he wanted to get rid of. Laura wrote (Dec. 26, 2002): > Neither can I buy the theology of anyone who supports > Hitler. Speaking of Hitler - If historically he wanted > to be a "religious" figure then he is a perfect example > of why "once saved always saved" is a problem! Izzy wrote (Dec. 26, 2002): > Laura, I must have missed something here-could you > please refer me to the exact post where someone on > TT said they "support Hitler"? Thank you. Laura wrote (Dec. 26, 2002): > It came from a post of Marlins and I don't still > have it on my computer. Marlin wrote (Dec. 26, 2002): > The source of that idea came from someone who is > no longer on TT, who uses Hitlarian propaganda > techniques. Izzy wrote (Dec. 26, 2002): > Laura, I do have all of Marlin's past posts > on my computer, and in none of them did he > state that he supports Hitler. I think that > is an untrue, if not unkind, statement. > Maybe Marlin would be kind enough to clarify > this issue for Laura? Marlin wrote (Dec. 26, 2002): > In my wanderings through the Web, I have sometimes > come across statements from Christians saying that > Adolf Hitler was an atheist, and more often, statements > from atheists saying that Hitler was a devout Christian. > He seems to be a guy that nobody wants on their team, > which I guess is fair enough, given the part that he > played in humanity's bloodiest endeavour. However since > some of the "Hitler was a Christian" comments have been > occasionally directed at me, I thought it would be wise > to investigate the matter for myself and see just what I > could come up with. > My conclusion is that Hitler, although he was brought up > and confirmed as a Catholic, had abandoned Christianity > by the time he was in control of Germany. Importantly > though, he was not an atheist either. Read on to find > out more. > http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/mischedj/ca_hitler.html Marlin wrote (Dec. 26, 2002): > "My feeling as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior > as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, > surrounded only by a few followers, recognized these Jews for > what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, > God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. > In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through > the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His > might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the > brood of vipers and adders. How terrific was his fight against > the Jewish poison. Today, after two thousand years, with deepest > emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before the fact > that it was for this that He had to shed his blood upon the Cross. > As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, > but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice. > And as a man I have the duty to see to it that human society > does not suffer the same catastrophic collapse as did the > civilization of the ancient world some two thousand years ago > - a civilization which was driven to its ruin through this > same Jewish people. > > "Then indeed when Rome collapsed there were endless streams > of new German bands flowing into the Empire from the North; > but, if Germany collapses today, who is there to come after > us? German blood upon this earth is on the way to gradual > exhaustion unless we pull ourselves together and make > ourselves free! > > "And if there is anything which could demonstrate that we > are acting rightly, it is the distress that daily grows. > For as a Christian I have also a duty to my own people. > And when I look on my people I see them work and work and > toil and labor, and at the end of the week they have only > for their wages wretchedness and misery. When I go out in > the morning and see these men standing in their queues and > look into their pinched faces, then I believe I would be no > Christian, but a very devil, if I felt no pity for them, if > I did not, as did our Lord two thousand years ago, turn > against those by whom today this poor people are plundered > and exploited." > > ( Adolf Hitler, in a speech delivered at Munich, April 12, > 1922; from Norman H. Baynes, ed., The Speeches of Adolf > Hitler: April 1922-August 1939, Vol. 1, New York: Oxford > University Press, 1942, pp. 19-20. ) Marlin wrote (Dec. 26, 2002): > "....1) Just because a person says he is a Christian does > not mean that he is one! This is essential to understand > when considering evil people of history and also when > considering where we personally stand with the Lord. > Therefore, I'll say it again: JUST BECAUSE SOMEONE SAYS > THEY ARE A CHRISTIAN DOES NOT MEAN THAT THEY ARE ONE!!! > > We know this is true in other areas. Suppose, for instance, > I claimed to be a vegetarian and later in the day you saw me > eating a Big Mac. Would you conclude that vegetarians eat > hamburgers or would you conclude that I wasn't really a > vegetarian. Obviously, the latter. ...." > http://www.shortreport.com/hitlerachristian.htm > This writer has said it best. --Marlin Marlin wrote (Dec. 27, 2002): > Dave M.: "Why is it that any of us feel any need > to defend Christianity? Why not instead simply > serve the person, Jesus Christ?" > > Amen --Marlin > > Dave M.: "In any case, someone needs to let Glenn > know that Marlin doesn't believe Hitler was a true > Christian. That ought to set some things straight there, > but I myself am in hotter fire now by arguing that > Hitler was a Christian, even though I add that he > was someone who did not truly follow Jesus Christ. > :-)" Amen --Marlin :-) Peace be with you. David Miller, Beverly Hills, Florida. ---------- "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
