----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2004 6:23
AM
Subject: [TruthTalk] Adams FALL
UPWARD
> From: "Blaine Borrowman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Blaine: I agree. It does seem a bit strange. It always has.
> But apparently not to most of the traditional Protestant churches of
> the Reformation. They had infants baptized, or Christianed, as they
> called it, because they thought the sin of Adam was still upon them.
>
> Judy:
> I don't know which 'traditional' Protestant churches you refer to here
> Blaine and they all have different reasons for doing what they do. The
> Methodists sprinkle babies and so do the Presbyterians and probably
> the Episcopal Church. I know that PCA people view it as the parents
> making covenant for the child... but whatever the reason there is one
> common basic understanding and this is the fact that every person
> born into this world by natural generation comes with a spiritual
> inheritance from the first Adam and this is what the scriptures teach.
> It is sin singular rather than sins plural which come later.
> Blaine: I agree. It does seem a bit strange. It always has.
> But apparently not to most of the traditional Protestant churches of
> the Reformation. They had infants baptized, or Christianed, as they
> called it, because they thought the sin of Adam was still upon them.
>
> Judy:
> I don't know which 'traditional' Protestant churches you refer to here
> Blaine and they all have different reasons for doing what they do. The
> Methodists sprinkle babies and so do the Presbyterians and probably
> the Episcopal Church. I know that PCA people view it as the parents
> making covenant for the child... but whatever the reason there is one
> common basic understanding and this is the fact that every person
> born into this world by natural generation comes with a spiritual
> inheritance from the first Adam and this is what the scriptures teach.
> It is sin singular rather than sins plural which come later.
> Blaine: So, Judy, do I take it from your comments below that infants are born with a residual sin, which must then be cleansed by baptism, sprinkling, or "making a covenant with" the child?
> Blaine:
> The Mormon article of Faith you quoted refers to this practice.
> The BoM speaks even more extensively against infant baptism.
>
> Judy:
> The scriptures do not promote infant baptism
Blaine: I agree. It seems
to be more of what I have been calling the Traditional Protestant Belief
System.
but Mary and Joseph
> did bring Jesus to the temple to present him before the Lord and it
> was understood that they would raise him in the faith which should
> be the understanding of those who present their babies before the
> Lord today.
> did bring Jesus to the temple to present him before the Lord and it
> was understood that they would raise him in the faith which should
> be the understanding of those who present their babies before the
> Lord today.
Blaine: I agree
this is a good thing. LDS infants are presented before the congregation
for a blessing, in much the same spirit as Jesus being presented at the
temple. But baptism does not occur until the child becomes of age to know
the difference between right and wrong, or later. Baptism is
seen by the LDS as a covenant to "take upon oneself the name of Jesus Christ,
and to become His disciple. This must be a matter of choice,
but with an infant, where is the choice?
>
> I assume the BofM has some way other than the blood of Jesus
> to get the sin babies are born into
Blaine: That is exactly the point, we do
not believe this doctrine. Children are born innocent. Jesus
said, "Suffer little children to come unto me, for of such is the kingdom
of God." This refers to their innocent
condition. How can they be ready for the Kingdom of God, except they be
innocent? If Adam's sin is still there, then they are not "Christianized,"
and therefore must be condemned to hell. Maybe these little children are
the ones that Protestant Priest was referring to when he told DaveH's nephew
some individuals go to hell in order to glorify God, thus showing his perfect
justice?
off of them and this is where
> Christianity and Mormonism part company.
> Christianity and Mormonism part company.
Judy
Blaine: Yes. Tradition and the truth
never the twain shall meet, apparently.
>
>
>
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> On Mon, 09 Feb 2004 23:03:55 -0800 Dave <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> ..We believe men will be punished for their own sins..To me it seems a
> bit
> strange that God would hold somebody responsible for another's sins, but
> I'm looking at it through biased eyes.
>
> This proves, explicitly, conclusively, that one cannot know God in Christ
>
> while adhering to LDS teaching; that LDS teaching has nothing to do with
> the NT/Gospel.
>
> http://OzG2004.blogspot.com
> ----------
> "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org
>
> If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
>
>
>
>
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> On Mon, 09 Feb 2004 23:03:55 -0800 Dave <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> ..We believe men will be punished for their own sins..To me it seems a
> bit
> strange that God would hold somebody responsible for another's sins, but
> I'm looking at it through biased eyes.
>
> This proves, explicitly, conclusively, that one cannot know God in Christ
>
> while adhering to LDS teaching; that LDS teaching has nothing to do with
> the NT/Gospel.
>
> http://OzG2004.blogspot.com
> ----------
> "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org
>
> If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
>
