RE: [TruthTalk] Re:How To Get Someone's Attention/punish someone

[ShieldsFamily]

Iz in red:   From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jonathan Hughes Sent: Friday, September 10, 2004 9:13 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Re:How To Get Someone's Attention/punish someone   Unfortunately you missed Lance’s point. Why are you people always thinking I missed the point? I GOT it, okay??? It is saying that your view of God (as exemplified through your post on the number of storms lately) is abhorrent.  Let me explain.   I am a father.  I have a 2 and a half year old son named Noah.  Now imagine that I beat him around the head a bit.  He goes to the hospital and they diagnose Noah as being deaf due to repeated blows.  The question is: what kind of father would you think that I am if this story was true?  There are few examples that would display a worse father.  Now, you believe that God sends storms to kill and maim people and cause massive devastation in order to get them to repent.  Let me quote you:   BTW, I thought about this and I want to add that I still believe that God can be sending a message about a need to repent from sin (individually, or statewide, or nationwide) when He allows such devastation.  Especially when there are 3 hurricanes in 3 weeks! We should all take it to heart, and should all pray for repentance on our part and mercy on His. Izzy   It is called divine child abuse and it is sick.  Perhaps you have never had to punish your children in any way, but most parents do.  This is a light form of discipline.  God sometimes gets much heavier handed when He disciplines because that is better than doing nothing at all and having a person go to hell eternally. Do you believe in hell? (Please answer.) And sometimes God is not disciplining (a nation for instance) but He is just plain bringing down long-put-off judgment.  Then there is no mercy—after many unheeded reproofs.  That is why I have learned to thank God for His reproofs: I heed them to avoid much more severe judgment later. I am so grateful that He cares enough to be involved in every bit of my life! God is not sending storms to punish unbelievers. Also Believers!  Storms are a natural function of a contingent world. I can understand those who don’t believer storms, for instance, might be sent/allowed by God.  They may be right.  However, I am of the viewpoint that God can and does use Nature, and anything else He created for His purposes at times. What may be beneficial in this conversation is to talk about how your viewpoint probably stems from an incorrect (and highly damaging) view of the atonement.  What happens to Jesus on the cross?  Was God murdering His own Son to appease some inflamed sense of justice?  Inflamed? Does the brutal death of Jesus somehow make God’s anger at sin go away? So what do you think it did?( Please answer.) I would suggest that this view of God is perhaps the single largest cause of depression in the Western world today.  Then why the heck am I so cheerful? Those who are depressed are unsure of where they stand with God, I believe. The gospel is Good News; so how can I be depressed? A worldview that begins with the Fall of man ends in death.  A worldview that begins in the heart of God, slain before the foundation of the world leads through the Fall and into life. I frankly don’t see any difference. They both have exactly the same components, in the same order. You just don’t think they do. People who believe as I do are not unaware that everything on God’s end was in place prior to the Fall. You just don’t think they are. This is gospel; this is good news.  Jonathan, I appreciate your viewpoint.  However, as far as I can see, it just ain’t scriptural.  Surely you are aware of the multitude of scriptures that affirm God’s judgments and reproofs? If you would like me to forward some I’ll be happy to do so.  Meanwhile, please back up your theory with scriptures (just for me?).  Thanks dear Jonathan, Izzy   Jonathan   From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of ShieldsFamily Sent: Friday, September 10, 2004 7:23 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Re:How To Get Someone's Attention/punish someone   Your parents, obviously, never spanked you.  Too bad. Izzy   From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir Sent: Friday, September 10, 2004 1:50 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [TruthTalk] Re:How To Get Someone's Attention/punish someone   Hit them up side the head with sufficient force to break their eardrum. Then, go to the other ear. Then, move on to other parts of their anatomy. This may be carried out following bad behavior. It may or may not alter their behavior. It will gain their attention I assure you.   This is a metaphor.