Hi Judy, for once I am actually in agreement with
you here. But I am left confused. On one hand you point to
Christ as the fulfillment of the law, that we do not have the law plus
Jesus.
jt: I don't know if we are saying the same thing
Jonathan. He (Jesus) fulfilled the Levitical Law which Israel did not
or could not keep according to Stephen (Acts
7:43)
Jonathan: From past posts of yours which seemed to
place primacy on the law and types I would have thought you would be more
supportive of Suzy's position. It appears that I was wrong in thinking
this of you. What I am now trying to understand is why you still think
we are under the blessings and curses of Deuteronomy but not under the laws
of Deuteronomy.
jt: Jesus who overcame death and
hell by the 'eternal Spirit' introduced the Kingdom of God
which is the Spirit of the Law rather than the letter of the law which
kills (not gnostic). God's nature, character and
standards, have not ever changed. What is different in this equation is the
believer in Christ who is born anew by the Spirit of God, indwelled and
instructed by the same Spirit, and is given a heart of flesh along with
the desire to love and obey our Lord and Master. So ultimately it is
God in Christ who causes us to overcome.
Please understand that I am honestly attempting to
understand you here, not to mock you. I have no follow-up post to slam
you regardless of what your answer is. I am attempting to put together
why from my perspective there seems to be a disconnect. Basically, why
are the blessings and curses not fulfilled in Christ when the law was?
jt: The Levitical or
Ceremonial law is what Christ fulfilled but God's moral standard or moral
law still stands and this is what we are judged by in the Last Day.
Jesus became a curse for us as per (Galatians 3:13). I don't
have a problem with loving and obeying God according to His Word. What I
have a problem with is putting oneself under these 613 Commands because
it is written that "They which be of faith are blessed with faithful
Abraham. For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for
it is written, cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which
are written in the book of the law to do them. But that no man is justified
by the law in the sight of God, it is evident; for, the just shall live by
faith and the law is not of faith; but the man that doeth them shall live in
them." (Galatians 3:9-12)
Can we separate them out so that one still
applies? Your answer may be that the law was a tutor to lead us to
Christ but that the blessings/curses have a different purpose and therefore
are still in effect.
jt: I personally love God's moral
law, commandments and statutes; actually Psalm 19:7-14 is probably my
favorite scripture or at least one of them; this and Matthew 6:33 are
dear to me.
judyt
By the way I think that your 'two
covenants/houses' analogy is quite good.
Jonathan Hughes
From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of Judy Taylor
From: Susan Petersen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Adhering
to the Law of Moses to earn salvation is legalism and bondage. There is
nothing we can do to earn our salvation. Once again I say that we follow the
Law out of love for Jesus. If you love Me you will follow my commandments.
And there is no difference between God's commandments and Jesus'
commandments.
jt: God's condition for salvation is the obedience
that comes through faith and Jesus did not give 613 Commands Suzy. The
law was given as a tutor or schoolmaster to show us the sinfulness of sin
and to lead us to Christ. It's not 613 Commands plus Jesus. There are
two houses or Covenants described in Hebrews 3:
"Therefore holy brethren, partakers of a heavenly
calling, consider Jesus, the Apostle and High
Priest of our confession. He was faithful to Him who appointed Him, as Moses
also was in all His house. For He has been counted worthy of more
glory than Moses, by just so much as the builder of the
house has more honor than the house. For every house is built
by someone, but the builder of all things is God. Now Moses was faithful in all His house as a servant, for a
testimony of those things which were to be spoken later; but Christ was
faithful as a Son over His house whose house we are
IF we hold fast our confidence and the boast of
our hope firm until the end" Judyt
