John S. wrote: > Colossians 1:21-23 > And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies > in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled > in the body of His flesh through [His] death... to present > you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight: > If ye continue in the faith... > > You, David Miller, have unwittingly left off a most important > consideration within this text and I have added it back into > the text (highlighted in bold print). I would venture to say > that you have omitted this portion of the passage because you > did not see it as being important to the discussion at hand. > What other noble reason could there be for the omission???
My reason for using the ellipsis and omitting the phrase was to draw attention to the part of the passage that you seem to omit in your reading of it. Your error here is called an error by emphasis. You so emphasize one point of the passage that you cannot see other aspects of the passage. John S. wrote: > You misunderstand (IMO) the teaching of this Col. > passage AS EVIDENCED by this omission. The omission was to try and keep us on track on the part of the passage that you overlook. I have no problems with this work being done through the body of his flesh and through his death. I could write volumes more about it too. However, you seem to overlook the result and purpose of this work, that we are presented HOLY and UNBLAMEABLE and UNREPROVEABLE ... IF WE CONTINUE IN THE FAITH. John S. wrote: > Well, our (yours and mine) theological construct is entirely > differeent -- as different as two world religions. I am of > the unmerited grace based, Jesus-did-it-all religion and you > are not. I would not characterize my perspective this way. I too am of the unmerited grace theology. The difference is that I see that grace works a real work within us that changes us into his image. To deny this is to deny the power of Christ. John S. wrote: > In this passage (Col 1:15-23 for those of you are following along), > I see the fact of reconciliation and the purpose of reconciliation . > The fact of reconciliation cannot be separated from the purpose, > in my thinking, and the following will demonstrate that point. > But first, let's establish the fact of reconciliation as present in > this passage. No need to because I already accept this fact. I don't find much of anything significant to disagree with in what you have presented about the fact of reconciliation. What we seem to agree about is that the fact of reconciliation leads to the result of holiness. It is our understanding of holiness that is different. I see holiness and manifested by living like Christ. You seem to see it as a legal position in Christ. John S. wrote: > And there is a purpose for this relational success. > We have been reconciled for a purpose. > For a purpose. Holiness. Blamelessness. > A life above reproach.......in His sight ............. > v. 23 if we continue !! Finally, a condition. > But this condition applies to the purpose and not > the fact of reconciliation. I agree, but if the purpose is not accomplished then we might question the fact upon which the purpose supposedly springs forth. John S. wrote: > ... the two (fact and purpose) CANNOT be separated. > The latter is accomplished in the fact of the former -- > and all the blessings of salvation are therein. I agree that the two cannot be separated. This is why I said that he put a condition upon our REALIZATION of this reconciliation. Now if the fact and the purpose cannot be separated, then the realization of us being holy and unblameable and unreproveable must be true if the fact of our reconciliation is true. The difference between us is that when I realize that this cannot be separated, then I reason that if holiness and unblameableness is lacking, then what you call fact (our reconciliation) must not be a reality. I think Paul points to this in this passage when he says, "IF YOU CONTINUE IN THE FAITH." He even identifies the fact of their alienation by their wicked works (Col. 1:21), so therefore, he also identifies the fact of their reconciliation by their holiness IF THEY CONTINUE IN THE FAITH. I think because of your Church of Christ background, you constantly misunderstand my theology and perspective. You have trouble understanding a holiness that is real that is apart from works of the law. You seem to think that holiness is some kind of state of being regardless of wicked works. You do not seem to understand that faith results in good works and righteousness. This Colossians passage brings these concepts together so clearly, I do not know how you can miss it. Perhaps after the excitement and novelty of being justified by grace begins to wear off, you might be more open to seeing other aspects of this passage. I recently received some email correspondence from a Church of Christ man who went street preaching with me several times back in the 1990's. He is explaining how he is moving away from the Church of Christ legalism and becoming more liberal. I can't help but think that I have influenced him this way and that is why he is writing me now after all these years. Some of what he says makes me think of you. I find much of what you write to be extremely legalistic and academic. You seem to be more concerned about our legal standing before God rather than our being a new creature who lives like Christ. Peace be with you. David Miller. ---------- "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
