On Tue, 17 Jan 2006 03:21:28 +0000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Dean, don't get too excited , here. Judy does not use the word "human" as the rest of use that word.Nor does she believe that Christ was God in the flesh ....I would ask you once more to control yourself JD and refrain from putting your words in my mouth.I am quite capable of speaking for myself; the above is incorrect.unless you ,too, believe that could be God while being something less than God at the same time.Yes, the Son of God. (John 14:28) for whom the Father was "greater" than he.If Christ is God in the flesh, then He is fully God because He simply could not be anything less than fully god without being something other than God at the same time. Neither can He be only part human without being somethin other than human at the same time.Of course he can. He can be whoever God says he is and wants him to be. He came as the suffering servant,remember??When we reject the incarnation of Christ because of the fact that we cannot comprehend how He can be fully God and fully man is an insult to the notion that He is unique (only begotton = unique). Uniqueness, true uniquessness as in "one of a kind" cannot be considered rationally.He can not be fully God and fully fallen man as you are trying to claim which to me is akin to Calvin makingGod responsible for the fall and all sin thereafter because in Calvin's opinion he decreed all that.I believe in a triune God because I SEE three personages , not because I can explain that reality to anyone !! It is faith that carries me beyond doubt on this matter and reminds me of my place in the order of this universe - the same universe of which God is the Creator.The triune Godhead can be seen in the scriptures.It is truly heresy to demand and pretend to fully understand Gd in three persons, or God in Christ, or God at all !!You can speak for yourself JD .. and you are the ONLY one you can speak for.jd-------------- Original message --------------
From: Judy Taylor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Excellent points DeanAnd you are not trying to cut Him up into different exclusive pieces - Hallelujah to King Jesus!!On Mon, 16 Jan 2006 20:11:54 -0500 "Dean Moore" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:cd: Can that likeness to human flesh also be a reflection of Christ's mental capacity?Did that capacity have the likeness to man or was there more? John the Baptist was said to be greatest among men-yet Christ was greater-How can both be true David if He was only a man? Could Christ be greater than the greatest man and only be a common man? The least in heaven is greater than John-yet there is none greater than Christ in heaven-if so they would have been able to open the book described in Rev.-none could. Yes, He was sent in the likeness of man and more-much more.What man can retain the memory of sharing glory with God from creation?In other words, in the same way that we speak of the likeness of Christ to Father God, so also we should speak of his likeness to humanity and human flesh.David Miller.cd: Can that likeness to human flesh also be a reflection of Christ's mental capacity?Did that capacity have the likeness to man or was there more?John the Baptist was said to be greatest among men-yet Christ was greater-How can both be true David if He was only a man? Could Christ be greater than the greatest man and only be a common man?The least in heaven is greater than John-yet there is none greater than Christ in heaven-if so they would have been able to open the book described in Rev.-none could. Yes, He was sent in the likeness of man and more-much more.What man can retain the memory of sharing glory with God from creation?----- Original Message -----From: Judy TaylorSent: Monday, January 16, 2006 3:25 PMSubject: [TruthTalk] love and trinity THE HUMANITY OF CHRIST IS NOT DIVINELikeness might mean like but not exactly like, but it also might mean so
much like it as to be indistinguishable. When we say that Jesus is the
image of Father, or that he is like the Father, so much so that when you
have seen Jesus you have seen the Father, it might be inappropriate to say
that Jesus is like the Father, but not exactly like him. Do you see it
differently, Judy? David Miller.I don't know .... When He walked the earth as a man He was not the Fatherbecause He prayed to the Father and when He said these words to Philip ie:"If you have seen me you have seen the Father" (John 14:9) I believe He isreferring to the ministry rather than to Himself personally because everythingHe said and did (both works and words) he had first seen the Father sayingand doing which he explains further in John 14:10 and John 5:19.----- Original Message -----
From: Judy Taylor
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 11:17 AM
Subject: Re: Fw: [TruthTalk] love and trinity THE HUMANITY OF CHRIST IS NOT
DIVINEOnly a similitude or likeness even "in every way" is not the exact same
thing JD.On Mon, 16 Jan 2006 16:12:30 +0000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
If you had responded by saying that the man Jesus did not have a human mind,
or a human spirit, or a human soul, then I would have had to disagree; for
then he would not have been like us in every way (cf. Heb 2.17).Like us is "similitude" Bill - it does not mean exactly the "same as" Every
human being born by procreation into this fallen world
is also fallen. There is none righteous and none that does good .... EXCEPT
ONE.Judy argues "like us" in total disregard of the additional phrase "IN EVERY
WAY"-------------- Original message --------------
From: Judy Taylor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>On Mon, 16 Jan 2006 08:16:00 -0700 "Taylor" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
I was just wanting to better understand what you were wanting me to agree
with in your statement: we agree if you view the Human part to also have
divine thoughts. Having read your response I am comfortable that we can
agree. The word "preoccupied" has a ring to it with which I am not
completely satisfied, but I believe the man Jesus was preoccupied with doing
the will of his heavenly Father; hence his thought-life was fully intuned to
the divine.If you had responded by saying that the man Jesus did not have a human mind,
or a human spirit, or a human soul, then I would have had to disagree; for
then he would not have been like us in every way (cf. Heb 2.17).Like us is "similitude" Bill - it does not mean exactly the "same as" Every
human being born by procreation into this fallen world
is also fallen. There is none righteous and none that does good .... EXCEPT
ONE.And, while I understood what you were saying, I also hesitate to speak of
the person of Christ in terms of "parts": if he is fully human and fully
divine, then he is not partly one and partly the other. Anyway, I knew what
you meant and could thus look through it.Thanks,Bill----- Original Message -----
From: Dean Moore
----- Original Message -----
From: TaylorSo that I know for sure what you mean to convey, let me ask you: do you as a
human have "divine thoughts"?Bill
cd: Yes to a limited degree-but I cannot hold the perspective that Christ is
limited in His divine thinking.I realize that the flesh would influence one
thinking to my limited 'divine 'thoughts but with Christ who walked
according to the Spirit I see no limitations. Nor do I admit there has to be
such weakness in us as we also have the Spirit-We simply are not willing to
pray and fast and abstain from things as one should to weaken this flesh and
hence allow more diviness to control us.
----- Original Message -----
From: Dean Moorecd: Yes we agree if you view the Human part to also have divine thoughts.
----- Original Message -----
From: TaylorIf I understand you correctly, Dean, you believe that Christ while walking
this earth was fully God. I DO TOO. And if I understand you correctly, you
also believe that Christ while on this earth was fully human. I DO TOO.Bill----------
"Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.orgIf you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
