Re: [TruthTalk] Rightousness (jd 2 cd)

[Taylor]

Dean insists  >  To have a masculine quality is to be a male.   Dean, are you willing to put your proposition to the test? Isaiah 42.13 says that "the LORD shall go forth like a mighty man; He shall stir up His zeal like a man of war. He shall cry out, yes, shout aloud; He shall prevail against His enemies." Does this verse stand as indisputable proof that God is a male? It certainly attributes masculine qualities to him: after all, one cannot dispute the fact that this verse likens him to a mighty man and a man of war. If your proposition is correct, Dean, we would have to conclude, based upon this verse alone, that God is indeed male. But what if the Bible attributes feminine qualities to God: by the same logic, wouldn't that make God female, also? While you're considering that question, let us read the very next verse: " I have held My peace a long time, I have been still and restrained Myself. Now I will cry like a woman in labor, I will pant and gasp at once." The Lord groaning like a woman in labor: surely there isn't anything more feminine than the cries of a woman in labor. Or how about this: "As a mother comforts her child, so I will comfort you" (Isa 66.13). Surely you would agree with me, Dean, that to be like a mother who comforts her child is to display certain feminine qualities. Or what about this: "You neglected the Rock who begot you, and forgot the God who gave birth to you" (Deu 32:18). Dean, the verb (chayal) used of God's giving birth in this verse is otherwise used in Scripture only of women in labor.   So what do you think, Dean: Do these feminine qualities make God female? May I answer for you? Of course it does not. These are similes, comparisons. They speak not of God's gender or sexuality but his relationship with creation. God is not male, just as he is not female. AND to claim one in abstention to the other is to neglect the other as being every bit as truthful and descriptive of our God. I am saying, let those comparisons depict his relationship with humanity and not his gender. In Deuteronomy 4.15-16 God tells his people what he thinks of them creating him in their image: " Take careful heed to yourselves, for you saw no form when the LORD spoke to you at Horeb out of the midst of the fire, lest you act corruptly and make for yourselves a carved image in the form of any figure: the likeness of male or female." We need to be careful, too, lest in our language for God we make of him something he is not.   Dean, please do not think when I defend Friesen that I think of God as being in the least bit female, or both male and female, as opposed to male only. I do not. When we read that God created humans both male and female in his image, this is not a reference to God's gender; it speaks instead to his nature as a relational being, a being-in-communion: the Father with the Son and the Son with the Father, in and through the Holy Spirit. That being so, there is no "image of God" in humanity apart from relationship: the image of God is persons in relationship with others persons and God himself. It is that which reflects his glory.    Bill   ----- Original Message ----- From: Dean Moore To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Wednesday, February 08, 2006 8:10 AM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Rightousness (jd 2 cd)       ----- Original Message ----- From: Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 2/7/2006 10:15:34 PM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Rightousness (jd 2 cd) cd: Is Jesus male or female John/Lance/Bill-If he is God as you say what is he?     Jesus is a man, Dean, and he is God -- two natures in one person. Please stop confusing the two.   You create God in Adam's image, and Judy calls us earthly minded: what a joke! Have you considered how close you are getting to a doctrine which claims that God the Father came down and had physical-sexual intercourse with Mary? You do claim he is male, don't you? That's like saying, since he has the equipment, why didn't he use it? This is ridiculous. "Male" is a physical/biological term. "Father" is a relational term, the same with "Son." You don't have to confuse the two. Yes, sometimes these terms coincide, but they are not requited to. Please, brother, stop with the accusations and smears (what has gotten into you?!), and just consider for a moment what you are suggesting: that God, being Spirit, has to have male attributes, over against female or a mixture of both -- as if he must have something between his legs or he can't be God. My gosh, people, he is Spirit; he is neither male, nor female -- nor both. Stop with the foolishness.   Bill cd: I realize you guys will not accept the Webster definition for the meaning of English words- as the rest of the world does- and have developed a whole new language but that is what I am using. To have a masculine quality is to be a male. God doesn't have a sexual organ as one is not needed in heaven as He can create humans from rocks or bones and still be the provider for the family as is the Father of a family. Thank you for the using words like silly-foolish and such like as you are only verifying my position in Jesus Christ and building my future:-) Notice # 4 if you are able-in the English language one can be male without the organ .Hence a masculine spirit is a male spirit-What are you not getting Bill-is all that dancing around making you tired? Masculine M`ASCULINE, a. [L. masculinus, from masculus, mas.] 1. Having the qualities of a man; strong; robust; as a masculine body. 2. Resembling man; coarse; opposed to delicate or soft; as masculine features. 3. Bold; brave; as a masculine spirit or courage. 4. In grammar,the masculine gender of words is that which expresses a male, or something analogous to it; or it is the gender appropriated to males, though not always expressing the male sex.       -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Plains.Net, and is believed to be clean.