On Mon, 4 Sep 2000, Jon Stevens wrote:
> i know that defining the .jar's is wrong, but there really isn't platform
> specific stuff that needs to be done. look at how the TDK does java1/java2
> build targets. remember, you are building turbine. i don't mind having build
> targets for java1/java2 at all.
yep - but it duplicates targets and increases
size/complexity of build file which is always a negative. It
is much better IMHO to have a simple build file (or as
simple as possible and no more simple :P).
> > Just curious (and not trying to start a falme war :P)
>
> neither am i. ever. please don't assume that i am. i just don't have time
> right now to fluff up my messages for you. i'm trying to get a boat load of
> work done.
:P
>
> > why
> > seperate the two ? What advantage does it have. A simpler
> > turbine build helps everyone and TDK includes masses of
> > other junk IIRC like tomcat etc
> >
> > Couldn't TDK just call turbines build file but do massaging
> > of properties passed into ant ? That would help both camps -
> > those who want to use TDK to run turbine and those who don't
> > ??
>
> sure...make that happen then. :-)
>
> no. the problem with jetspeed is that kevin hasn't done any work to make it
> easy on his users to install it. that is different than categorizing ALL
> apache projects based on just his project.
perhaps I don't know. I went through hell to setup turbine
recently - while it is all documented the documentation has
a level of assumed knowledge - which I didn't have :P. I had
to traul through src files to catch up in understanding from
when I last played with turbine.
TDK will reduce setup time but as soon as they want to do
non-trivial stuff or merge different source trees they got a
huge leap.
> > Following a standard decreases learning curve and increases
> > chance that it will be adopted. I am trying to push turbine
> > at people and they are much more likely to bite if a
> > standard is adopted.
>
> then show me the documented definition of that standard and let me in on
> that process.
I tried to propose such a thing a while back -
unfortunately it was right before someone posted about
trying to split xerces compiler - the list was promptly
swamped and I promptly hit unsubscripbe button.
But I don't think there needs to be a bit of paper to say
that something is a standard. Take make - almost always the
build files are one of "Makefile", "makefile" or
"makefile.mk". I don't know of any standards document that
said that it should be so - it just is :P. Just like
"./configure;make;make install" is standard behaviour for
installing from source drops on unix boxes.
By standard I don't mean a bit of paper - I mean the way the
majority of peeps do it :P. Have a look at some of java
projects either at apache or at sourceforge and you will
notice that most have a structure similar. (Or haven't
revised the structure since ant was first introduced).
> not in the current scheme because build-turbine.xml is in the build
> directory. since turbine may eventually have a lot of build files, i want
> them in a directory instead of at the top level root directory.
yep they would go into "src/mk". This would include things
for unit testing, profiling, database creation magic etc.
> > $ANT_HOME/bin/ant[sh|.bat]
> > $ANT_HOME/bin/antRun[|.bat]
> > $ANT_HOME/lib/ant.jar
> > $ANT_HOME/lib/xerces.jar
> > $ANT_HOME/lib/<other support libs>.jar
>
> so? it works just fine with the way things are right now and it isn't in
> that structure.
thats because you don't use ant the way it is set out to be
used. You setup your own classpath, own ant.home etc
etc. You make it difficult for other people who are familiar
with ant and the way it is used elsewhere to enter the
project.
Anyways you can be safe from my ideas - I aren't a committer
:P
Cheers,
Pete
*--------------------------------------------------*
| Latrobe University, | Does the name 'Pavlov' |
| Bundoora, Australia | ring a bell ? |
*--------------------------------------------------*
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