> On 27 Feb 2017, at 11:23, Martin Broerse <[email protected]> wrote: > > Hi Jan, > > By `the hosting feature` I mean the rewrite rules and the vhost. Good to > hear that is not going away.
I said attachments are not going away. rewrites and vhosts are probably not going to be re-implemented in a new http layer (unless we find someone who wants to write the code and maintain it, *hint* *hint*) Best Jan -- > > - Martin > > > On Mon, Feb 27, 2017 at 11:04 AM, Jan Lehnardt <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Not sure what you mean with `the hosing feature`, but attachments are not >> going away. >> >> FWIW, I’d be in favour of having a modern CouchApp platform hooked into >> CouchDB, but in the past 5 years we haven’t found anyone who’d be willing >> to put in the work. >> >> Best >> Jan >> -- >> >>> On 27 Feb 2017, at 10:58, Martin Broerse <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> Hi Jan, >>> >>> If we split thinking about CouchApp in the hosting part and the backend >>> coding part it would not hurt our usage if we lose the coding part. The >>> coding part we need on the backend like password resetmails and other >>> scheduled tasks are not there so the coding part needs to be more >> powerful >>> before we can use it. We can solve this tasks with OpenWhisk so perhaps >>> keep the hosting feature and lose the rest? >>> >>> The Ember guys at LinkedIn found it is faster to eval javascript loaded >> as >>> strings than loading the javascript from the backend. We have not tested >>> this yet but if this is true we can perhaps bootstrap javascript apps >> from >>> strings hosted in CouchDB but we still need the CouchDB hosting part for >>> the bootstrap code. >>> >>> So in the future we are for keeping the hosting and lose the rest. >>> >>> - Martin >>> >>> On Mon, Feb 27, 2017 at 9:18 AM, Jan Lehnardt <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi Martin, >>>> >>>> thanks for your comment. >>>> >>>>> On 27 Feb 2017, at 07:52, Martin Broerse <[email protected]> >> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> We use the hosting from couchapp for many projects via >>>>> https://www.npmjs.com/package/ember-cli-deploy-couchdb so keep it in >>>>> couchdb. To replace excel sheets in businesses it is super you don't >>>> need a >>>>> separate hosting stack. An example couchapp hosted only on Cloudant: >>>>> https://bloggr.exmer.com >>>> >>>> Existing versions of CouchDB that support CouchApps aren’t going away, >>>> and I’m sure Cloudant will keep things around for a while, too. >>>> >>>> This is about the future of CouchDB and the non-existent developer >>>> time that is required to maintain these features as CouchDB evolves. >>>> >>>> Best >>>> Jan >>>> -- >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> - Martin >>>>> >>>>> On Sun, Feb 26, 2017 at 6:40 PM, Jan Lehnardt <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Aurélien, >>>>>> >>>>>> I see that at least at some point you were subscribed and >> participating >>>> on >>>>>> the [email protected] mailing list. From the stated goal of >>>> the >>>>>> list (find a new technical foundation for CouchApp) and the lack of >>>>>> significant engagement (users and devs alike) there, it should have >> been >>>>>> clear where this is headed. >>>>>> >>>>>> And just to reiterate: >>>>>> >>>>>> 1. CouchApp was an attempt to revolutionise web development as we know >>>> it. >>>>>> — It failed, in like 2011. >>>>>> >>>>>> 2. It was designed in a world before Node.js. Most folks who want to >> do >>>>>> JavaScript and CouchDB have moved on. >>>>>> >>>>>> 3. There are SEVERE technical limitations, most of which aren’t as bad >>>> as >>>>>> a view index generator, but VERY bad for anything OLTP (think CGI from >>>> 90s). >>>>>> >>>>>> 4. The features are unmaintained at this point, future refactorings >>>> might >>>>>> make the unavailable (e.g. in a http layer rewrite). The last >>>> significant >>>>>> work on the relevant code is 5-6 years in the past. >>>>>> >>>>>> 5.We invited the CouchApp community to step up and build a >> future-ready >>>>>> version of CouchApps, complete with a design direction and own mailing >>>>>> list.. Nobody stepped up, and at the end of the day, a project goes >>>> where >>>>>> developers can spend time. >>>>>> >>>>>> 6. and to be clear, we are talking about: 1. _show & _list 2. _update >>>>>> funs, 3. rewrites // for the time being, we’ll keep >> validate_doc_update >>>> and >>>>>> filter functions, but plan to replace them with per-doc access control >>>> and >>>>>> Mango schema enforcement. The idea of design docs, or attachments on >>>>>> documents are not going away. >>>>>> >>>>>> In terms of ease of building web apps: a Node.js process running next >> to >>>>>> CouchDB is only minimally more setup hassle and gives you: >>>>>> >>>>>> 1. The same baseline features, plus a lot more. >>>>>> 2. A simple app building model. >>>>>> 3. A RICH ecosystem of third party libraries. >>>>>> 4. WAAAAAAAY better performance and scalability. >>>>>> 5. A future for you to do just the things you are already doing >> without >>>>>> moving to another platform. >>>>>> >>>>>> Best >>>>>> Jan >>>>>> -- >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> On 25 Feb 2017, at 18:22, Aurélien Bénel <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi Joan, >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Your email is aggressive, and your apology is not accepted. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I didn’t want it to be. I beg you for your pardon then. >>>>>>> My frustration was real, but I can assure you that I am not an >>>>>> aggressive person. >>>>>>> There would not have been any ambiguity in my mother language : >>>>>>> discussing technologies in a foreign language is one thing, >> expressing >>>>>> your feelings is another. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> This topic has been discussed to death on the mailing lists and I am >>>>>> not going to be pulled into a retread of this argument. >>>>>>>> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/couchdb-dev/ >>>>>> 201702.mbox/%3CB6DB98EC-42B1-4960-9E43-257F040238F1%40apache.org%3E >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I’m just a « user »… a very dedicated and passionated user (I’m in >> the >>>>>> top 10% on StackOverflow about CouchDB and I taught CouchDB to more >> than >>>>>> 150 french software engineers), but a user. That’s why I never >>>> subscribed >>>>>> to the « dev » mailing list (or for a very short period of time). I >> now >>>>>> understand that I should have, but it’s too late. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> My frustration is as high as has been my passion for six years for >> this >>>>>> incredibly interesting project. >>>>>>> I respect the board decisions but now I will have a hard time finding >>>>>> money (which is sparse in academic research) to move all of our >>>> software to >>>>>> a different technology stack and arguments to explain to all of my >>>>>> collaborators that I bet on a technology stack that got rapidly >>>> deprecated. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thank you for your understanding. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Best regards, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Aurélien >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Professional Support for Apache CouchDB: >>>>>> https://neighbourhood.ie/couchdb-support/ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Professional Support for Apache CouchDB: >>>> https://neighbourhood.ie/couchdb-support/ >>>> >>>> >> >> -- >> Professional Support for Apache CouchDB: >> https://neighbourhood.ie/couchdb-support/ >> >> -- Professional Support for Apache CouchDB: https://neighbourhood.ie/couchdb-support/
