Hello Pierre,

Many thanks. I now understand the difference between WIP as a product type
and as an inventory and accounting concept. I also - correct me if I am
wrong - understand that in 'ProductionRunDeclaration.groovy ' it requires
product type NOT to be WIP in order to 'produce'.  However, and as I
understand better from data and code, could you kindly share - from your
mentioned implementation - those records that explain the relationship
between the different production runs? data from ProductAssocs and
WorkEffortAssocs will give me a clearer understanding.

Regards,
Emad

On Mon, Aug 26, 2024 at 10:39 AM Pierre Smits <pierresm...@apache.org>
wrote:

> Hi Emad, all,
>
> First, for a better understanding of what a WIP product is about have a
> look at: https://www.investopedia.com/terms/w/workinprogress.asp
>
> A WIP product is in essence a a means to facilitate asset value
> calculation at the end of a reporting period (month, quarter, year).
>
> So, it depends.... Not only on the complexity of the BOM and schema steps,
> but also on when the financial/fiscal reporting requirements (like e.g.
> when the reporting year ends).
>
> If you have a production schema which has steps that can lead to a step in
> a production run going from one day to the next, it can run from one
> reporting period to the next (e.g. long duration steps in the brewing
> process, where fermentation/maturing can take multiple days, or even short
> steps happening in evening/night shifts).
> In such a case you can use the WIP classification as production type. But
> I would say this adds additional accounting complexities in your setup,
> that need to be investigated and tested.
>
> in the first iteration of me implementing  OFBiz for breweries ( see  #1),
> I started out with defining a single BOM and associated production schema
> to get to the first finished product (beer), but that led to a unique
> schema for each style/variant of beer. Which made production planning (and
> reporting) a nightmare. Breaking up such a production schema (and its BOM)
> into multiple (dependent/linked schemas) made life easier wrt using OFBiz
> regarding production planning and execution, registration of inventory
> movements and resource utilization, and reporting (accounting) on asset
> value and costs.
>
>
> #1:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OFBIZ/Brewing+with+OFBiz+at+a+small+or+medium+sized+brewery
>
> I trust the above helps you in finding the optimal solution for your
> 'unique' business case/scenario. Should you have additional questions
> and/or remarks, feel free to reach out.
>
> Met vriendelijke groet,
>
> Pierre Smits
> *Proud* *contributor** of* Apache OFBiz <https://ofbiz.apache.org/> since
> 2008 (without privileges)
> Proud contributor to the ASF since 2006
> *Apache Directory <https://directory.apache.org>, PMC Member*
>
> Anyone could have been you, whereas I've always been anyone.
>
>
> On Tue, Aug 20, 2024 at 10:31 AM Emad Radwan <eradwan1...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Hello Pierre,
>>
>> Few clarifications, please. First, for the new products that we'll create
>> - using your explanation above - is it correct to say that they'll be
>> 'intermediate' products with 'WIP' product type?
>>
>> Second, Can we have the the whole process - while having the possibility
>> to declare intermediate products - in a single production run or it
>> requires 'child' production runs?
>>
>> If the process above can fit in one production run, then what
>> configuration is required to make this happen?
>>
>> Regards,
>> Emad
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 19, 2024 at 2:02 PM Emad Radwan <eradwan1...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hello Pierre,
>>>
>>> Many thanks for the detailed explanation. I have a number of
>>> follow-up questions that I'll get back to you on in the next few days as I
>>> review the relevant code to make sure I'm asking the right questions.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Emad
>>>
>>> On Wed, Jul 17, 2024 at 1:36 PM Pierre Smits <pierre.sm...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Emad,
>>>>
>>>> A production run to produce Asprin sounds like a process-oriented
>>>> manufacturing method (similar to producing 'scrambled eggs' you can't unmix
>>>> the Asprin mixture).
>>>>
>>>> If you have a requirement for 100.000 tablets, I would break it down to
>>>> multiple production schemas to keep it simple: 1 for producing the mixture,
>>>> 1 for producing the tablets from the mixture, and 1 for packaging the
>>>> tablets. The reason for this is to factoring the waste aspects for the
>>>> production runs, but also to have intermediate inventory registration:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>    1. in the mixture process, residue could remain in the mixing and
>>>>    transport equipment leading to 100% (of the weight) of ingredients 
>>>> going in
>>>>    results in  > 100% of output. E.g. 100 kg of ingredients > 98 kg of 
>>>> mixture
>>>>    2. in the tablet production process, again 100% of the mixture of 1
>>>>    (98 kg) could lead to > 100% of output.
>>>>    3. in the packaging process, the tablets registered in 2 may lead
>>>>    to the last container (box, bag, etc.) not having the correct quantity.
>>>>
>>>> Thus process 1 (schema 1) should have a weight step at the end, which
>>>> could account for the actual going into an intermediate inventory product
>>>> And process (schema2) should have a 'tablet' counter at the end to
>>>> determine the 'actual' quantity of produced tablets that goes into
>>>> inventory.
>>>>
>>>> Also, given that you're talking about a food related product, batch/lot
>>>> registration is essential. Mixing different batches/lots from production
>>>> run 1 and 2 to get to the required output (100.000 tablets) would introduce
>>>> unmanageable risks.
>>>>
>>>> Now, coming back to your ask about the 'Declare'  on a task, this would
>>>> do something similar within a production run. In a production run task you
>>>> can 'declare' the output of a task (e.g. the mixture), which is then the
>>>> starting point of the next task (but I have found it to be more difficult
>>>> to explain regarding waste, by-products and batch/lot registration, when I
>>>> introduced OFBiz as a Brewery Management Solution at several breweries).
>>>>
>>>> I trust the above helps.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Met vriendelijke groet,
>>>>
>>>> Pierre
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Jul 11, 2024 at 8:33 PM Emad Radwan <eradwan1...@gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hello Community,
>>>>>
>>>>> Assume I have a routing for Asprin - a batch of 100000 tablets -
>>>>> manufacturing where there're 7 tasks to make the product. Lets say
>>>>> that in
>>>>> the first 5 tasks we didn't reach the 'tablet' form yet. My question
>>>>> is,
>>>>> why the 'Declare' button for one of those tasks is available?
>>>>>
>>>>> By pressing 'declare' we have a form to edit the task where some
>>>>> fields I
>>>>> understand like actual timings but I don't get fields like
>>>>> QuantityProduced
>>>>> for such tasks where we don't have a 'finished product' yet.
>>>>>
>>>>> Also appear another form - in the - Production Run Declaration section
>>>>> -
>>>>> that allow to add an inventory item for 'any' product the user selects!
>>>>>
>>>>> Do you find it logical to have the above visible for such middle
>>>>> tasks? Is
>>>>> there a way to configure it to display with tasks that will actually
>>>>> deliver the finished product?
>>>>>
>>>>> Are the uses cases for this that I'm missing?
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> Emad
>>>>>
>>>>

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