Mainly I thought I'd interrupt the ranting :)
And what's tomcat if it's not an implementation of JSP / Servlets, and
hence a partial implementation of J2EE?
--
"His comrades fought beside him, Van Owen and the rest...
But of all the thompson gunners- Roland was the best."
Josh McDonald
Analyst Programmer
Information Technology
Ph: 61 7 3006 6460
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14/12/2005 4:38:20 pm >>>
And, Josh, last time I looked JSP was not on the list we are talking
about.
So, what was your point?
On 12/13/05, Josh McDonald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Last I checked servlets / jsp were part of J2EE.
>
> --
>
> "His comrades fought beside him, Van Owen and the rest...
> But of all the thompson gunners- Roland was the best."
>
> Josh McDonald
> Analyst Programmer
> Information Technology
> Ph: 61 7 3006 6460
> Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14/12/2005 4:31:21 pm >>>
> Preston, none of those examples are J2EE. They can be used with
J2EE
> but
> they have nothing to do with anything beyond J2SE.
>
>
> On 12/13/05, Preston Crawford <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > > I don't know what the future will hold. JSF may win the day on
> nothing
> > > but marketing alone. It has the force of being a "standard",
and
> while
> > > not all standards ultimately succeed, it certainly is a leg up
on
> other
> >
> > I would argue that with Java (J2EE specifically) "standards" have
> largely
> > just "emerged". Think of all the examples.
> >
> > Tomcat
> > Ant
> > Struts
> > JUnit
> > Hibernate
> >
> > That's, by and large, the "standard" J2EE toolkit. And by that I
mean
> that
> > while we may have WebSphere, Tapestry, Maven, EJBs, etc. there's a
> certain
> > concensus out there and the tools in the first list are what have
> the
> > mindshare now.
> >
> > So my point of interest is this. JSF, from what I'm seeing here
> > (especially when the actual developers of Struts talk about their
> reasons
> > for jumping to JSF) and reading elsewhere is actually succeeding
IN
> SPITE
> > of the fact that it's not sitting in the OpenSource non-standard
> seat, as
> > Tapestry is. I find this interesting. It was bound to happen
> eventually,
> > that one of Sun's reference implementations would actually become
a
> > standard. I know, EJB is a standard. But look how many people have
> been
> > abandoning that in favor of more lightweight solutions, once those
> > solutions presented themselves.
> >
> > So I think the fact that JSF is getting traction IN SPITE of the
fact
> that
> > it isn't quite as open, hasn't been open sourced as long as
Tapestry,
> etc.
> > is a testament to the fact that developers appear to like it. I
just
> > wanted to know (and you all have been immensely helpful in this
> respect)
> > if you could get done with it, what you can with Struts. Thus the
> question
> > wasn't "Is JSF better than Struts?" The question was "Is JSF
ready?"
> >
> > And that is the question for me. I know what I can and can't do in
> Struts.
> > I've been programming with it for 5 years. I know its power and I
> also
> > know I've been involved with some amazingly convoluted hacks to
make
> it do
> > what we needed. A framework that handles more of the
> request/response
> > plumbing for me is welcome. A framework where *maybe* I can use
tools
> that
> > are WYSIWYG if I want is appealling after 5 years of hand-coding
XML
> > descriptor files that are gigantic. A framework that handles
requests
> and
> > responses and doesn't push as far back into the business tier is
> welcome
> > to me.
> >
> > So I like the idea of JSF. Just like I like the idea of Tapestry
and
> even
> > Ruby on Rails. I just wanted to know if you could write a JSF app
> today
> > and be reasonably sure that you could do easy validation on the
> server, be
> > relatively efficient in it and not run into major snafus with
> application
> > server differences.
> >
> > Preston
> >
> >
> >
>
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> >
>
>
> --
> "You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its
> back."
> ~Dakota Jack~
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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--
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its
back."
~Dakota Jack~
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