On Fri, 04 Oct 2002 14:34:45 John David Galt wrote: ... >> Sound familiar? It is the same problem with SI adoption. No one is going >> to use SI if the old system is allowed to persist. > >Decades of experience in the USA show that this is not true at all. Without >any laws or policies to restrict the use of imperial, we already have: > And I'm afraid your argumentation below does not hold water either! I'll explain why below.
>- Metric tooling (bolt/nut/wrench sizes and the like) having mostly replaced >inch-based sizes, mainly due to the auto industry, which finds it cheaper to >produce cars for all markets in metric. I believe even the American makes >have all switched. > One of THE main reasons for this "shift" was the clear economic advantage behind the production of metric components AND metric design that were COMBINED with the fact that there was an overwhelming majority of metric "designers" in the global arena as compared to ifp ones! Now compare this with the situation in the aviation industry and you'll understand what *REALLY* happened here. Metric tooling as you called it happened in the US mostly because of factors they would not be able to control to turn it into their favor (i.e. ifp tooling). Trust me, should the situation be like in aviation and you would certainly NOT have seen metric tooling prevail!!! Therefore, your assumption above is somewhat naive and inaccurate (sorry, pal...). >- The "fifth" of liquor has been entirely replaced by the 750 ml bottle. > Ditto, due to the domination of Europeans in this industry! >- Soft drinks are widely available in both metric and US measures, with the >2L and 0.5L bottles here to stay. > Again, the sizes that remained metric have a predominant component of foreign businesses behind their support. But look at the 20 fl.oz., 12 fl.oz crap! They are STILL with us because the US insisted on marketing this junk all over the place! >>... Think of the >> costs and mistakes that occur daily in industry as companies have to deal >> with two systems of measurement. > >There aren't that many. Unfortunately, again, I must side with the other John here. YES, there ARE such costs, besides the intangibles associated with the confusion of units out there. > And I'm a firm believer in doing things voluntarily >no matter what it does to people with grandiose plans for everybody. > And there are things in life that *absolutely require* careful planning, organizing AND rigid implementation for them to work. Metrication is just one of them. ALL cases of metrication that have been completely successful are associated with mandatory requirements on groups, governments, industries, ALL stakeholders involved and affected by it. This is just an undeniable fact, my friend. >> Can you imagine the chaos if the EU did things the American way? > >They wouldn't have jailed that guy in Britain recently for selling meat by >the pound. And it's a violation of human rights that they did. > Sigh... "Ati tu, Brutus"? A thousand times NO, JD, NO! The guy was arrested NOT because of the use of ifp units, but due to the use of *ILLEGAL* scales, that were not properly certified for public use by the standards authorities! This wrong *propaganda* is what the 'guy in Britain' has been trying to sell to the world, and unfortunately you seem to have "bought" into it!... >Can you imagine the chaos if the metric system had been compulsory when it >was first introduced? France would not have been able to abandon the metric >calendar (which lasted until Waterloo) or the metric clock (which was so >confusing they abandoned it after 16 months). > Yes, I can 'imagine' it! And you know what? I love what it *could* have been! Indeed the metric clock could still be with us, as flawed as it still was. I'd take 10 hours of 100 minutes of 100 seconds ANYTIME, ANY DAY versus this stupid 24-60-60 crap we still use today!!!!! And the metric calendar would be a hassle indeed for me, a Sabbath keeper, but it would NOT detain me from honoring the Lord's day, trust me! BTW, the calendar aspect, yes, I agree with you, would have been a huge mistake! But it would not have survived, compulsory or no compulsory, due to formidable religious pressure against it from ALL types of religions! Yes, you'd see Jews, Christians, Buddhists, Muslims, EVERYONE opposed to it! Certainly a non-starter... :-S >These are not the only metric units that didn't make sense. "Grads" of >angle were useless, and I'm glad that they're no longer part of SI. >Both degrees and radians are much more useful mathematically. > And here, I'm not sure what you mean by 'grads', if you refer to the French 'grades' then I'll part company with you on this one, too!!! Gons are JUST AS 'USEFUL' as the degree stuff. The only nuisance to it is the 30, 60 degree "family" which would be mathematically "intractable", but a small price to pay IMHO. ... >On the contrary. The larger nations in the EU are having problems *now* >because the stability pact that came with the Euro limits them to 3% >deficits (though there's a proposal to delay enforcing this until 2004, a >"band aid" solution that just casts doubt on the future stability of the >Euro). Actually, I see the Euro kicking butts!!! It'll just be a matter of time, trust me!... ;-) (I'm even already working towards 'europeanizing' my main assets here!...) > Meanwhile the very different fiscal policies of the countries >involved are causing trade distortions, which in the old days could have >been solved by devaluing one country's currency against the others. >All this will only get worse if/when the EU expands eastward. > Not so, because the monetary, political union of Europe makes it an almost de facto country where these 'distortions' you allude to are effectively watered down. Your assertion is unfortunately groundless and time will certainly prove you wrong (and already has been!...). >If the nations of the EU were willing to commit to following a single >economic policy (with the same taxes and tax rates, the same levels of >public spending, the same rules covering employment, and so forth), so >that they're practically a single nation, having the Euro would make >sense. But if this doesn't happen (and it's almost certain it won't), >the Euro will have to be abandoned, probably within twenty years, and >until that happens it will be a millstone around the necks of its users. > Very good! But they already ARE, so your assumption is evidently moot in this regard, my friend. I.e. they know *exactly* what they're supposed to do to make it work and all separate members are doing their part to make sure it'll continue to be so. (NOTE: perhaps if you read the accords, rules, regulations, etc, surrounding the creation of the EURO currency you would understand it better. So I'd strongly encourage you do it) >> It is just a matter of time before our poor >> planning methods catch up with us and we are left behind in the dust. > >The fact that we _don't_ have the kind of command economy you advocate >is the reason that we're not in a depression, and Japan (which does) is. >... Hmm... Debatable. The 'immunity' your economy is enjoying now is shaky at best. If global trade starts not going your way you'll start seeing this thing fall like a deck of cards, and very quickly so! Cheers, Marcus Is your boss reading your email? ....Probably Keep your messages private by using Lycos Mail. Sign up today at http://mail.lycos.com
