Thanks for all these thoughts Philippe! Have you investigated any of the swift-based web frameworks like Kitura or Vapor? I may poke around with them a bit - but I need to learn swift first.
I do like the availability of java libraries and jdbc connectivity. Tim > On Feb 19, 2020, at 4:10 PM, Philippe Rabier via Webobjects-dev > <webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com> wrote: > > We considered using Typescript but we faced weird behaviors so we gave up. > Too much stuff to learn at the same time. And it should help developing your > code but it doesn't help when you work with external libraries. > And I remember Benoit Marchant (MontageJS) saying: "if you want to embrace > the web, you have to learn JavaScript". > > I forgot to mention we use also Vue on the front side which is really good. > Much simpler to learn than React or Angular.io <http://angular.io/>. > > To be honest, I won't use node for my next adventures. I would consider Go, > Swift or maybe Kotlin/Java. Or Python if I'm using Google Cloud Functions > because the code is small so the dynamic language is not a pain (but I never > try yet so I dunno). But GCF is very appealing. > > Philippe > ———————————— > Sent from my iPhone > > >> On 19 Feb 2020, at 23:44, Gino Pacitti via Webobjects-dev >> <webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com> wrote: >> >> Typescript tries to give you a more Java feel to JavaScript - maybe you >> could try that? You can use it via npm and cli or in an ide >> >> >> >>> On 19 Feb 2020, at 20:12, Philippe Rabier via Webobjects-dev >>> <webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com> wrote: >>> >>> Hi Tim, >>> >>> I worked as CTO in a company where Node has been chosen and I didn't want >>> to trouble the team and continue w/ the same technology. >>> >>> So I decided to jump in the train and learned JavaScript, node etc. >>> It's not an easy language if you want to get benefit of the dynamic part of >>> the language. >>> >>> What I disliked a lot is the fact it's very complicated to refactor the >>> code because as you know it's not a typed language so you discover the bug >>> while code execution. As a result the app must be fully tested. It's really >>> not an option. I used Webstorm which is a great IDE but can do very little >>> when you refactor the code or when you need to include modules (like the >>> import in java). >>> >>> Moreover, the eco-system is poor quality compare to java libraries. Often >>> libraries are not maintained. I remember my team using ftp client which >>> worked great but then the provider changes to ftp over ssl and the library >>> didn't support it so we have to choose another one which was not well >>> designed. >>> >>> If you follow this path, I recommend using Koa rather than express.js which >>> is the most used library w/ node but Koa is really well designed and more >>> recent. (Koa is like ERRest ;-)). We used also MongoDB v4 which is better >>> than I thought (and much better than it was in the past). We used Mongoose >>> which is like an ORM but as it's a document database it's a bit different. >>> Moreover Mongoose "encapsulates" pure JavaScript objets (like EO compare to >>> pojo) so we had from time to time to copy the mongoose object into pure >>> JavaScript object to use other libraries like lodash (a must have library). >>> >>> So I have a mixed feeling about this environnement. But as a friend said: >>> with Java compiler even a young developer (or bad one) creates a code that >>> runs. Not the case with javascript where code can be ugly very easily. >>> >>> Philippe >>> ———————————— >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> >>>> On 18 Feb 2020, at 20:40, Tim W via Webobjects-dev >>>> <webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> Thanks for this Lon. >>>> >>>> As I begin contemplating a move from WO -> Cayenne, I’m really >>>> appreciating hearing what folks are using from a front-end perspective. >>>> Wicket looks like a pretty interesting one and from a familiarity >>>> perspective may be the best I’ve seen coming from a WO background. >>>> >>>> Since I haven’t made the leap I don’t know how folks are binding various >>>> front-end technologies, like angular etc., to a ORM backend. I’m assuming >>>> by moving toward web api’s. >>>> >>>> From a non-familiarity perspective (and focused more on broadening >>>> skillsets), I’m thinking of looking at Node.js to leverage ORM experience >>>> but also branch more into front-ends the way the kids are doing it. I >>>> don’t expect many from the WO army have gone that direction but curious to >>>> hear of any experiences. >>>> >>>> Tim >>>> UCLA GSE&IS >>>> >>>>> On Feb 14, 2020, at 10:50 AM, Lon Varscsak via Webobjects-dev >>>>> <webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com <mailto:webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com>> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> We've settled on Apache Wicket (apps are being re-written from WO) with >>>>> Apache Cayenne (EOF-like but more modern). I love both, I would be sad >>>>> if I had to use a different toolset. >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Feb 14, 2020 at 12:14 AM Jérémy DE ROYER via Webobjects-dev >>>>> <webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com <mailto:webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com>> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> Hi >>>>> >>>>> And about wo components framework ? >>>>> >>>>> What are you using with Bootique ? >>>>> >>>>> Jérémy >>>>> >>>>>> Le 13 févr. 2020 à 23:08, Matthew Ness via Webobjects-dev >>>>>> <webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com <mailto:webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com>> >>>>>> a écrit : >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I wouldn't hesitate to recommend Bootique. >>>>>> >>>>>> We've had various types of Bootique apps in production for years now to >>>>>> great success, some with the Cayenne module directly derived from older >>>>>> WO apps/dbs, some communicating with existing WO apps, others simply >>>>>> processing tasks. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Regards, >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Matt >>>>>> http://logicsquad.net <http://logicsquad.net/> >>>>>> https://www.linkedin.com/company/logic-squad/ >>>>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/logic-squad/> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Thu, Feb 13, 2020, at 11:25 PM, Andrus Adamchik via Webobjects-dev >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> My opinionated take is the following: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> * The "official" JavaEE is dead and is now a pure volunteer effort >>>>>>> under https://jakarta.ee/ <https://jakarta.ee/> . The "appserver" >>>>>>> concept has almost disappeared and morphed to something different. All >>>>>>> the past market leaders have moved on to more lightweight solutions, >>>>>>> though some still cling to .war deployment. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> * SpringBoot is the market leader in the Java world. If you are looking >>>>>>> to build a marketable Java developer resume, learn SpringBoot. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> * If you need to write apps for your org or your customers, and are not >>>>>>> constrained by the PHBs opinion, use Bootique. It is a better platform >>>>>>> in the modern appserver-free world. Bootique is "commercially-viable" >>>>>>> in a sense that there are hundreds of apps that run in prod for a >>>>>>> number of years. But it is still an open source effort supported by >>>>>>> community and a mid-sized company (ObjectStyle), so it is sometimes an >>>>>>> uphill battle in organizations that are looking to conform to the >>>>>>> lowest common denominator. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> So you decide :) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Andrus >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Feb 13, 2020, at 3:06 PM, Gino Pacitti via Webobjects-dev >>>>>>>> <webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com >>>>>>>> <mailto:webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Thanks for that… it looks really interesting… >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Is it a commercially viable alternative to some of the others like >>>>>>>> JBoss, Tomcat, Websphere etc.. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I would like to add another feather to my bow but not really sure >>>>>>>> which architecture to devote time to so that I can work on bigger >>>>>>>> projects in a team... >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 13 Feb 2020, at 11:16, Andrus Adamchik <and...@objectstyle.org >>>>>>>>> <mailto:and...@objectstyle.org>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> We are using Bootique: https://bootique.io/ <https://bootique.io/> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Just like SpringBoot, its idea is that it is not an "appserver". It >>>>>>>>> gives you a plain Java app with your own "main" method, and a way to >>>>>>>>> assemble various components together (and also modularity, dependency >>>>>>>>> injection, consistent configuration and a large collection of >>>>>>>>> ready-to-use modules). The app can serve web requests, run jobs or do >>>>>>>>> whatever. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Unlike SpringBoot, Bootique is much smaller, starts much faster, and >>>>>>>>> doesn't feel like magic. Also all the apps you write are >>>>>>>>> automatically equipped with POSIX CLI. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Andrus >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Feb 11, 2020, at 4:29 PM, Paul Yu via Webobjects-dev >>>>>>>>>> <webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com >>>>>>>>>> <mailto:webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Spring and it’s ecosystem seems to be pretty powerful. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Paul >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>>>>> Please excuse iOS autocomplete >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Feb 11, 2020, at 8:06 AM, Gino Pacitti via Webobjects-dev >>>>>>>>>>> <webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com >>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> hey if any one was to use a different app server configuration >>>>>>>>>>> other than WO what would you choose and why? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> What are most companies requesting these days in a Java system? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. 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