Here is a link to the hacked data for a read. http://www.megaupload.com/?d=XD050VKY
On 11/28/09, Steven Parker <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi Edward > > Sorry mate no fallacy, no conspiracy IPCC climate scientists actually > have been scandousily busted cooking and destroying the data on > global warming, this should be welcomed by wikieducators with an open > mind (No denial) for what this means fro teaching (The scientific > process) why not give students links to this controversy, have a a > learning activity on climate change science, denialism, crime and > fraud, sociology, behaviorism, media, computer hacking you name it. > I'll not try to convince you on what this means for the global warming > science that's up to you, read the climategate info though it sounds > like you have it figured out as conspiracy (ok) for others Google > "climategate" and read the news, there is a great student activity > within. > > http://www.google.com.au/search?q=climategate+new+zealand&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&client=firefox-a > > I found this video interview with Dr Tim Ball rather interesting > > "Retired climatologist Dr. Tim Ball joins us to discuss the > significance of the recently leaked emails and documents" > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ydo2Mwnwpac > > Fascinating, I'm sure there is more to follow. > > http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/fpcomment/archive/2009/11/26/lawrence-solomon-new-zealand-s-climategate.aspx > > http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/jamesdelingpole/100017977/climategate-the-scandal-spreads-the-plot-thickens-the-shame-deepens/ > , > Cheers > > > > > On 11/28/09, Edward Cherlin <[email protected]> wrote: >> This turns out not to be the case. More below. >> >> On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 23:16, Steven Parker <[email protected]> wrote: >>> "denial of the existence of global warming, or denial of the truth of >>> evolution? The space race is a product of movie special effects? The >>> earth >>> is flat? It is difficult for me to imagine my believing such. Do they >>> deserve a hearing?" >>> >>> Some of these are obviousily very ridiculous but yes it is a real >>> problem >>> giving controversial issues a hearing, for example alot of educational >>> resources have been created and taught to students on the existence of >>> global warming based on the impact of human carbon emissions. >>> >>> From an education point alot has been politically and personally >>> invested >>> in >>> this premise based on IPCC data but yet only recently as I'm sure many >>> of >>> you are aware there has been the "Climategate" controversy whereby the >>> British Climatic Research Unit's computers at the University of East >>> Anglia >>> where hacked. From this emails and documents have been published which >>> show >>> IPCC endorsed scientists engaged in the the falsification and >>> destruction >>> of data >> >> Humpty Dumpty fallacy: Words mean only what I want them to mean, >> rather than having different meanings in different contexts. >> >> By no means. In fact, shame on you for being fooled by industry shills >> and True Believers in Conspiracy Theories. >> >> http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2009/11/26/17302/203 >> >> DS: When Phil Jones wrote in 1999, "I've just completed Mike's Nature >> trick of adding in the real temps to each series for the last 20 years >> (i. e. from 1981 onwards) and from 1961 for Keith's to hide the >> decline," what did he mean? >> >> Michael Mann: Phil Jones has publicly gone on record indicating that >> he was using the term "trick" in the sense often used by people, as in >> "bag of tricks", or "a trick to solving this problem ...", or "trick >> of the trade". In referring to our 1998 Nature article, he was >> pointing out simply the following: our proxy record ended in 1980 >> (when the proxy data set we were using terminates) so, it didn't >> include the warming of the past two decades. In our Nature article we >> therefore also showed the post-1980 instrumental data that was then >> available through 1995, so that the reconstruction could be viewed in >> the context of recent instrumental temperatures. The separate curves >> for the reconstructed temperature series and for the instrumental data >> were clearly labeled. >> >> and so on. >> >>> and vindication of "sceptical scientists" with data contrary to the >>> global warming hypothesis. >> >> Cherrypicking fallacy. >> >> Also not the case, as discussed in the same story and many others on >> Daily Kos and elsewhere. The scientists have taken account of daily >> and annual warming and cooling cycles, the cooling effect of volcanic >> aerosols and warming from volcanic CO2, variations in El Niño/La Niña, >> and a multitude of other measured and modeled effects tending to more >> or less warming at particular times. Carbon-industry pseudo-scientists >> follow the techniques pioneered by tobacco industry pseudo-scientists, >> picking out one factor or another and claiming that it invalidates the >> analysis that actually includes it, while ignoring all of the real >> data, and expecting the public not to check up on them. >> >>> i.e the science is most definitely not closed. >> >> Strawman fallacy. >> >> Science is never closed. A theory can only be closed if it is held in >> a closed mind. >> >> We are still running tests on General Relativity, such as the recently >> completed Gravity Probe B. Initial analysis suggested detection of >> frame dragging, but a problem in tracking the rotations of the test >> spheres has put that result under a cloud. It was not clear when I >> last checked whether further analysis will clear up the matter. Denial >> of global warming would be equivalent to claiming that the failure of >> this experiment to return a valid result somehow calls General >> Relativity into question, even though the GPS system couldn't possibly >> work without GR time calculations for orbiting atomic clocks. >> >> The issues in global warming do not extend to whether it is occurring. >> The measurements of global air and water temperature, and of melting >> ice and permafrost, are unequivocal. The questions are how much, how >> fast, and with what effects on sea levels, agriculture, disease, >> extinctions, and other matters that affect human well-being. >> >> It is correct to say that all global warming models have been wrong. >> This does not help the deniers, because the models have all been wrong >> in the wrong direction. All of the major indicators show that warming >> is worse than expected, and accelerating faster than predicted. >> >> Contrary to all conspiracy theories, climate models have been >> consistently conservative. The Southern Ocean around Antarctica is >> apparently saturated, as it has recently begun releasing about as much >> CO2 as it absorbs. If this extends to the whole ocean, the rate of >> accumulation of CO2 in the atmosphere will roughly double from the >> current rate. If the Arctic sea ice disappears, ocean currents may >> change dramatically. If the permafrost melts, it may release huge >> amounts of methane, a more powerful greenhouse gas than CO2, though >> not so long-lived in the atmosphere. I could go on. >> >> As with Holocaust Denial and "Creation Science", trivial objections >> are put forward to True Believers as reasons to dispute the entire >> story, a story actually based in each case on vast records and other >> evidence. The Holocaust occurred at large numbers of sites, for which >> detailed records were kept, whether or not you can find the remains of >> the demolished gas chambers or cremation ovens at Auschwitz. Evolution >> is a fact, not a theory. Many billions of facts, in fact. We can >> discuss details of DNA, ribosomes, the genetic code, the RNA world, >> the lack of a detailed roadmap of abiogenesis, but none of the >> questions about details and unknown sequences changes our >> understanding of mutation processes and of natural and sexual >> selection. Nor do the fake fossils of human and dinosaur footprints >> together. And the AIR and WATER and ICE and DIRT and ROCKS are >> WARMING, and the oceans are getting more acid. No possible discrepancy >> in modeling or in use of easily misunderstood jargon can change those >> facts. >> >>> See: >>> http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/British_Climatic_Research_Unit%27s_emails_hacked >>> >>> Climategate: Dr. Tim Ball on the hacked CRU emails - >>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ydo2Mwnwpac >>> >>> Does this deserve a hearing? Yes most definatley otherwise an education >>> wiki >>> becomes non objective and counter to the aims of educating people into >>> the >>> area of indoctrination. >> >> It has had a hearing, and has been extensively debunked. Do your >> homework. Search for comments on the issue using Google, and see >> whether you can tell the science from the pseudoscience. >> >>> Yes a real problem despite it being difficult to imagine. >> >> Cold fusion is a more interesting case. We are quite certain that >> chemists Fleishman and Pons believed their conclusions for a long >> time, even though physicists poked holes in every announcement, and >> published quantum mechanical analyses showing why their result was >> imossible. I can provide details if anybody needs them, or you can >> look it up. The graphs of supposed gamma ray emission from their >> experiments were physically impossible, because they showed no >> reflected gamma rays at the appropriate energy shifts. The next set of >> graphs showed the features required by that criticism, but failed to >> show others. And so on. Nevertheless, scientists tried to replicate >> their results for more than a year, without success, before giving up. >> Scientists never do an experiment or run a model just once. >> >> Deniers do no experiments and build no models, but claim that any >> single error in any scientific paper is grounds for throwing out the >> whole idea. This is based on a misunderstanding of the term >> "falsification" by Karl Popper in his book Conjectures and >> Refutations. One observation does not constitute a fact, and one fact >> does not refute an established theory. The Michelson-Morley >> experiments conducted over more than a year conclusively demonstrated >> that Classical Physics was incomplete for motion at a significant >> fraction of the speed of light, but not that it was fundamentally no >> good. Nobody abandoned physics between those experiments and >> Einstein's Relativistic explanation. We know that quantum mechanics >> and General Relativiy cannot both be complete, and in fact we expect >> that both are incomplete. But we do not throw them out. They remain >> accurate as far as they go. Someday, something new will go farther, >> and the old theories will be seen to be approximations of the new >> theory in the old realm, while the new theory explains much more in >> new realms. >> >>> On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 3:43 PM, Phil Bartle <[email protected]> >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Rant for this weekend is about controversial subjects >>>> See: http://www.wikieducator.org/User:Philbartle#Phil.27s_Rants >>>> Cheers, >>>> Phil >>>> If the coach does the pushups, >>>> The athlete will not get stronger >>>> Community Empowerment: >>>> www.scn.org/cmp/ >>>> WikiEducator >>>> http://www.wikieducator.org/User:Philbartle >>>> Join our discusssion forum >>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Community_Strengthening >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "WikiEducator" group. >>>> To visit wikieducator: http://www.wikieducator.org >>>> To visit the discussion forum: >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/wikieducator >>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> [email protected] >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "WikiEducator" group. >>> To visit wikieducator: http://www.wikieducator.org >>> To visit the discussion forum: >>> http://groups.google.com/group/wikieducator >>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> [email protected] >> >> >> >> -- >> Edward Mokurai (默雷/धर्ममेघशब्दगर्ज/دھرممیگھشبدگر ج) Cherlin >> Silent Thunder is my name, and Children are my nation. >> The Cosmos is my dwelling place, the Truth my destination. >> http://www.earthtreasury.org/ >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> Groups "WikiEducator" group. >> To visit wikieducator: http://www.wikieducator.org >> To visit the discussion forum: >> http://groups.google.com/group/wikieducator >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> [email protected] > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "WikiEducator" group. 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