Mike - thank you - and to Nemo as well for a more concise answer than mine. :)
I agree about the cross-posting - and my hunch is that will come with time. Like any new outreach idea, it will need some time to mature, and it may not work out - but I think this one is worth trying. If it doesn't work (although I personally expect it will) - we'll try something else. :) Thanks! -greg On 1 Jul, 2012, at 6:02 PM, Michael Peel <michael.p...@wikimedia.org.uk> wrote: > Hey Greg, > > Great answer - thanks. :-) It does sound like that's quite a distinct > audience here that most likely wouldn't be interested in the other emails > that are sent to WikimediaAnnounce-l (e.g. chapter and WMF reports). I hope > that there will be appropriate cross-posting to both lists for announcements > that are/may be of interest to both audiences. > > Thanks, > Mike > > On 1 Jul 2012, at 22:49, Gregory Varnum wrote: > >> Hey Mike, >> >> I'm not sure I have a very satisfying answer beyond - I think we did not >> want to "spam" a low-traffic list largely made up of non-developers with >> developer related updates. >> >> My sense is this list's target audience is a rather niche group of >> volunteers. However, their size is often disproportionate to the value they >> can contribute as developers. Many are paid to maintain MediaWiki >> installations and as such, already develop tools beneficial to the rest of >> us. However, given their motives, they are often less engaged than our core >> developers. This has often led to corporate and other powerful wikis >> running MediaWiki having custom extensions, themes, etc. that could benefit >> others. In talking with those folks, the sense I got was they did not want >> the usual volunteer info, and did not want discussions. They simply wanted >> to know the best ways to keep their tools alive in our developer community >> without getting fully embraced in our developer community. This seemed like >> a reasonable middle ground. That doesn't speak to every type of person that >> may find this list helpful - but in general I think a very small fraction of >> current members of wikimediaannounce-l would find this interesting and I >> think very little of that list's traffic would be interesting to the folks >> on this new list. lol - that make sense? >> >> All of that said, I would not be shocked if a better solution emerged in the >> future or if that list's group one-day wanted to become more integrated into >> general Wikimedia culture, vs the very niche private developer community. >> >> -greg >> >> PS. I'm scrambling to get ready for a family vacation - so apologies if >> this is not well written. :) >> >> >> On 1 Jul, 2012, at 5:39 PM, Michael Peel <michael.p...@wikimedia.org.uk> >> wrote: >> >>> Hi Gregory, >>> >>> Could I ask a related common question - why not just send these out on >>> WikimediaAnnounce-l? >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Mike >>> >>> On 30 Jun 2012, at 06:49, Gregory Varnum wrote: >>> >>>> Cross-posting. >>>> >>>> -greg >>>> >>>> Begin forwarded message: >>>> >>>>> From: Gregory Varnum <gregory.var...@gmail.com> >>>>> Subject: New, lower traffic, announcements only email list for Wikimedia >>>>> developers >>>>> Date: 30 June, 2012 1:23:11 AM EDT >>>>> To: wikitec...@lists.wikimedia.org >>>>> >>>>> Greetings, >>>>> >>>>> Following discussions with Wikimedia developers more on the "fringe" and >>>>> not as engaged in frequent IRC or mailing list conversations, the request >>>>> for an announcements only mailing list came up. I wanted to let folks >>>>> know that this list has been created and is ready for membership: >>>>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-announce - >>>>> wikitech-annou...@lists.wikimedia.org There will also be a signup list >>>>> for this and other lists at Wikimania Hackathon. >>>>> >>>>> Unlike this list, which allows for discussion, or the MediaWiki-announce >>>>> list, which focuses exclusively on MediaWiki release announcements, >>>>> wikitech-announce will be used for occasional announcements on both >>>>> MediaWiki and broader Wikimedia developer related news items. This >>>>> includes an announcement when monthly tech or engineering reports are >>>>> posted, important news updates on git or developer related tools, and >>>>> information on upcoming sprints, events or other major developer >>>>> collaborations. >>>>> >>>>> Having presented this idea a few times, there are some common questions I >>>>> will get out of the way now. >>>>> >>>>> Why not just send these out on MediaWiki-announce? There was quick >>>>> reaction from several of these less-engaged developers that some really >>>>> did want JUST MediaWiki release info sent out on that list. In other >>>>> words, the audience of that list did not like the idea. >>>>> >>>>> Will this duplicate emails sent to wikitech-l? Probably, but it is not >>>>> designed for folks already utilizing wikitech-l - it is designed for >>>>> folks who would like less email traffic and want announcements - not >>>>> conversations. >>>>> >>>>> Is this really going to save folks that many emails? In June, the >>>>> wikitech-l list had 639 individual messages (so far). It is unlikely >>>>> that this list would exceed 12 a month. For reference, >>>>> MediaWiki-announce has sent out 3 messages this month and mediawiki-l had >>>>> 121 messages. This list presents a middle ground between the two >>>>> extremes. >>>>> >>>>> Do we not already have enough lists? Yes, but as our developer community >>>>> grows, so too must our means of communicating. Many individuals, myself >>>>> included, have been intentionally trying to engage developers generally >>>>> less present, but just as important to our community. Such as corporate >>>>> developers with an interest in sharing extensions who can benefit from >>>>> announcements about git. Similarly, some students would prefer to get >>>>> basic info that helps them stay on top of the latest developments. >>>>> >>>>> Generally, if you find yourself having a concern about this list, it is >>>>> probably not the list for you to join. However, if you find yourself >>>>> excited at the idea of less development chatter while remaining informed, >>>>> this might just be the list for you. >>>>> >>>>> Thank you to Sumana and TheHelpfulOne for supporting this effort and to >>>>> Daniel Renfro for proposing this idea and getting the discussion started. >>>>> >>>>> I have volunteered to moderate the list at its start, but will be >>>>> interested in recruiting others that are willing to help. Anyone with an >>>>> announcement can submit one, and a moderator will approve messages which >>>>> fit within the list's scope. >>>>> >>>>> Finally, like any new tool, I anticipate its usage will evolve over time >>>>> - so please do engage in discussion on any ideas you may have for its >>>>> future. >>>>> >>>>> Thank you! >>>>> -greg aka varnent >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Wikimedia-l mailing list >>>> Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org >>>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Wikimedia-l mailing list >>> Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org >>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Wikimedia-l mailing list >> Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org >> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l > > > _______________________________________________ > Wikimedia-l mailing list > Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l
