I don't think it is useful to discuss projects and people, discuss processes and fixes.
On Wed, May 3, 2017 at 12:15 AM, Lodewijk <lodew...@effeietsanders.org> wrote: > Hi John, > > Could you provide a bit more context? From which language are you drawing > these experiences? Did you consider filing a phabricator request for the > technical component that can be improved (if so, could you link to it)? > Could you also provide some links to these discussions that are causing the > internal fighting you refer to? > > I'd be curious to understand better what you're talking about before taking > a position. Thanks! > > Best, > Lodewijk > > 2017-05-02 17:20 GMT+02:00 John Erling Blad <jeb...@gmail.com>: > > > Yes, I wonder if the extension for content translation should be turned > > off. Not because it is really bad, but because it allows creating > > translations that isn't quite good enough, and those translations creates > > fierce internal fighting between contributors. > > > > Some people use CT, and makes fairly good translations. Some are even > > excellent, especially some of those based on machine translations through > > the Apertium engine. Some are done manually and are usually fairly good, > > but those done with the Yandex engine are usually very poor. Sometimes it > > seems like the Yandex engine produce so many weird constructs that the > > translators simply gives up, but sometimes it also seems like the most > > common errors simply passes through. I guess people simply gets used to > see > > those errors and does not view them as "errors" anymore. > > > > Brute force solution; turn the ContentTranslation off. Really stupid > > solution. The next solution; turn the Yandex engine off. That would > solve a > > part of the problem. Kind of lousy solution though. > > > > What about adding a language model that warns when the language > constructs > > gets to weird? It is like a "test" for the translation. The CT is used > for > > creating a translation, but the language model is used for verifying if > the > > translation is good enough. If it does not validate against the language > > model it should simply not be published to the main name space. It will > > still be possible to create a draft, but then the user is completely > aware > > that the translation isn't good enough. > > > > Such a language model should be available as a test for any article, as > it > > can be used as a quality measure for the article. It is really a quantity > > measure for the well-spokenness of the article, but that isn't quite so > > intuitive. > > > > The measure could simply be to color code the language constructs after > how > > common they are, with background color for common constructs in white and > > really awful constructs in yellow. > > > > It could also use hints from other measurements, like readability, > > confusion and perplexity. Perhaps even such things as punctuation and > > markup. > > > > I believe users will get the idea pretty fast; only publish texts that > are > > "white". It is a bit like tests for developers; they don't publish code > > that goes "red". > > _______________________________________________ > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > > wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > > wiki/Wikimedia-l > > New messages to: Wikimediaemail@example.com > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> > _______________________________________________ > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > wiki/Wikimedia-l > New messages to: Wikimediafirstname.lastname@example.org > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> > _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimediaemail@example.com Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>