Why would we "not want it to be a membership organization"? In fact, many of us want exactly that, since the WMF seems to think it can lord it over the communities instead of fulfilling its role of serving them.
The new Board rules basically say that the Board itself gets to say how the community-based members are selected, instead of having actual bylaws as to how it happens. I'd like to see it done very simply: Those eight seats (forming a majority) on the Board should be elected (not nominated, elected) by the community, with the Board having no veto power over the results of the election. Todd On Wed, Oct 7, 2020 at 12:45 PM Brad Patrick <[email protected]> wrote: > This is a very, very old and tired argument. If you do not understand > United States non-profit corporations, go educate yourself about those > first. If your perspective is non-US based, you may have a different frame > of mind which is irreconcilable with the way WMF is. Take all the time you > need to see the differences before attacking WMF for (a) what it is and (b) > why it isn't what you want it to be. > > WMF exists legally, and has as its foundation organizational principle, > authority vested in a Board. WMF is not a membership organization. You > would not want it to be a membership organization (as a matter of law). > > Please temper your criticism accordingly. > > Brad Patrick > Former WMF General Counsel > > On 10/7/20, 12:47 PM, "Wikimedia-l on behalf of Paulo Santos Perneta" < > [email protected] on behalf of > [email protected]> wrote: > > I knew they are theoretically self-appointed, but was under the > impression > that at least until now an appearance of democracy and legitimacy > towards > the community has been respected, which no longer seems to be the case. > I wonder what would be the legitimacy of a self-appointing body in the > eyes > of the Wikimedia Movement, and all the communities which are part of > it? > > Regards, > Paulo > > Adam Wight <[email protected]> escreveu no dia quarta, > 7/10/2020 à(s) > 17:20: > > > Greetings, this is a semiautomated response pointing out that the > > Wikimedia Foundation Board is not elected, it's self-appointing. The > > so-called "elections" are in fact nominations to be considered by the > > Board. Therefore, the Bylaws have not been broken. > > > > This is an unfortunate arrangement, please see [1] for some > background > > about the conversion from a membership organization to a > non-membership > > organization which is no longer legally required to hold elections. > > > > Regards, > > > > Adam W. > > [[mw:User:Adamw]] > > > > [1] > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Foundation_membership_controversy > > > > On 10/7/20 5:55 PM, Paulo Santos Perneta wrote: > > > The terms of 3 BoT members expired last month, and the BoT itself > decided > > > to extend them? What is the legitimacy of that? And why is a BoT > which is > > > expected to be in a mere interim management waiting for elections, > > > presenting profound changes to its Bylaws [1]? > > > > > > [1] - > > > > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Foundation_Board_noticeboard/October_2020_-_Proposed_Bylaws_changes > > > > > > Best, > > > Paulo > > > > > > Nataliia Tymkiv <[email protected]> escreveu no dia quarta, > > 7/10/2020 > > > à(s) 16:49: > > > > > >> Hello, > > >> > > >> I can answer a few of the questions raised in this thread. > > >> > > >> When the Board postponed the community selection of trustees, we > also > > >> extended the terms of the trustees in the affected seats (María > > Sefidari, > > >> Dariusz Jemielniak, and James Heilman)[1]. Their terms were > originally > > set > > >> to expire last month, but because of that term extension they are > still > > >> serving as trustees, and as such María remains the Board Chair and > > Dariusz > > >> and James continue on as Committee Chairs[2]. > > >> > > >> Raju Narisetti and Esra'a Al Shafei have been reappointed to the > Board > > for > > >> an additional three-year term[3][4]. > > >> > > >> The current members of the Board of Trustees are listed on the > Wikimedia > > >> Foundation website[5]. > > >> > > >> We do not currently have a shortage of trustees on the Board, and > we > > have > > >> had a quorum for every decision we have made this year. We have > > published > > >> some outstanding Board records, many of which were just approved > at our > > >> recent meeting in September[6][7]. > > >> > > >> I have just sent an email to this list, as well as posted an > update to > > >> Meta-Wiki, with a request for feedback on matters related to the > > >> Foundation’s Bylaws and trustee selection[8]. That announcement > contains > > >> more information about the postponed community selection of > trustees. > > >> > > >> Best regards, > > >> > > >> antanana / Nataliia Tymkiv > > >> > > >> Vice Chair, Wikimedia Foundation Board of Trustees > > >> > > >> [1] > > >> > > >> > > > https://foundation.wikimedia.org/wiki/Resolution:Postponement_of_Community_Selection_of_Trustees_and_Extension_of_Community_Selected_Trustee_Terms_until_next_selection_process > > >> > > >> > > >> [2] > > >> > > >> > > > https://foundation.wikimedia.org/wiki/Resolution:Board_Officers_and_Committee_Membership,_2019 > > >> > > >> > > >> [3] > > >> > > >> > > > https://foundation.wikimedia.org/wiki/Resolution:Renewing_Raju_Narisetti%27s_Appointment_to_the_Board_of_Trustees,_2020 > > >> > > >> > > >> [4] > > >> > > >> > > > https://foundation.wikimedia.org/wiki/Resolution:Renewing_Esra%27a_Al_Shafei%27s_Appointment_to_the_Board_of_Trustees,_2020 > > >> > > >> > > >> [5] https://wikimediafoundation.org/role/board/ > > >> > > >> > > >> [6] https://foundation.wikimedia.org/wiki/Meetings > > >> > > >> > > >> [7] https://foundation.wikimedia.org/wiki/Resolutions > > >> > > >> [8] > > >> > > >> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Foundation_Board_noticeboard/October_2020_-_Call_for_feedback_about_Bylaws_changes_and_Board_candidate_rubric > > >> < > > >> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Foundation_Board_noticeboard/July_2020_-_Call_for_feedback_about_Bylaws_changes_and_Board_candidate_rubric > > >> > > >> *NOTICE: You may have received this message outside of your normal > > working > > >> hours/days, as I usually can work more as a volunteer during > weekend. > > You > > >> should not feel obligated to answer it during your days off. > Thank you > > in > > >> advance!* > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> On Thu, Oct 1, 2020 at 9:52 PM Bill Takatoshi < > [email protected]> > > >> wrote: > > >> > > >>> After I asked my questions on September 4, I was sent the message > > >>> below by some role account I've never heard of, asking about > claims > > >>> that have used the names of five other people. I don't edit > under my > > >>> real name, but I have never used the names in the linked forum > > >>> postings. > > >>> > > >>> The linked posts also claim that the Foundation's nonprofit > status is > > >>> at risk. I am not a lawyer, but I am skeptical of that claim even > > >>> though five Trustees whose three-year terms expired in August > > >>> apparently voted on a Resolution in a Board meeting on September > 24. > > >>> According to Section 4 of the Bylaws, "A quorum shall consist of > a > > >>> majority of Trustees then in office." Section 6 says, "the Board > may > > >>> continue doing business as a Board during the vacancy of any > Trustee > > >>> position." Therefore, since four of the five remaining Trustees > all > > >>> voted in favor, the Resolution was properly carried, in my > layperson's > > >>> view. I am less certain about the propriety of allowing a Trustee > > >>> whose three year term expired to continue to serve as Chair. > > >>> > > >>> The lack of any update or even ETA for an update on > > >>> > > >>> > > >> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Wikimedia_Foundation_elections/2020#Postpone%3F > > >>> is baffling. Elections have never been held in person, only > online, > > >>> and so the excuse that they were postponed because of the > pandemic > > >>> crisis seems extremely suspicious. Indefinitely delaying > elections for > > >>> such a vacuous reason makes the Foundation look like the worst > of the > > >>> bad actors in today's international political climate. Doesn't > the > > >>> cancelled travel of the pandemic crisis give the Foundation more > time > > >>> to hold elections, not less? Whether non-profit status is at > risk or > > >>> not, I would hope that the Foundation, Board, and Elections > Committee > > >>> would be more interested in upholding the principles of good > > >>> governance than failing to even announce a new schedule or even > a date > > >>> by which a new schedule will be announced. > > >>> > > >>> -Will > > >>> > > >>> On Mon, Sep 14, 2020 at 10:31 PM Gender Desk < > [email protected]> > > >>> wrote: > > >>>> Mr. Takatoshi, > > >>>> > > >>>> Wikipediocracy has suggested that you have also used the names > "Rogol > > >>> Domedonfors, Renée Bagslint, Jennifer Pryor-Summers, Felicity > Braingut, > > >>> Thomas Townsend and others." > > >>> http://wikipediocracy.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=11567 > > >>>> Can you comment on that? > > >>>> > > >>>> Regards, > > >>>> Genderdesk > > >>>> > > >>>> genderdesk.wordpress.com > > >>> > > >>> On Mon, Sep 14, 2020 at 7:38 PM Samuel Klein <[email protected]> > > wrote: > > >>>> Can anyone from the elections committee comment? What is the > current > > >>>> plan? //S > > >>>> On Fri, Sep 4, 2020 at 8:05 PM Bill Takatoshi < > > [email protected] > > >>>> wrote: > > >>>> > > >>>>> How long can the Foundation legally postpone Board of Trustees > > >>> elections? > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Wikimedia_Foundation_elections/2020#Postpone%3F > > >>>>> has a comment from April saying, "Once things get moving again, > > >>>>> appopriate [sic] date for the election will be decided and an > > >>>>> announcement will be made." > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Foundation_Board_of_Trustees#Current_members > > >>>>> suggests that five board members terms end on "Wikimania 2020" > -- but > > >>>>> is that accurate? > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >> > > > https://foundation.wikimedia.org/wiki/Resolution:Term_Limit_Proposal_for_Bylaws > > >>>>> is clear that "All Board terms are three years" and "the term > of each > > >>>>> such appointment shall not exceed three years." > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Who are the current members of the Board of Trustees? > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Can the board achieve a quorum in its present state? > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Who is the Chair currently? > > >>>>> > > >>>> -- > > >>>> Samuel Klein @metasj w:user:sj +1 > 617 529 > > >>> 4266 > > >>> > > >>> _______________________________________________ > > >>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > > >>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > > >>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > > >>> New messages to: [email protected] > > >>> Unsubscribe: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > >>> <mailto:[email protected] > ?subject=unsubscribe> > > >>> > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > > >> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > > >> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > > >> New messages to: [email protected] > > >> Unsubscribe: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > >> <mailto:[email protected] > ?subject=unsubscribe> > > >> > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > > > New messages to: [email protected] > > > Unsubscribe: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > <mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe> > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > > New messages to: [email protected] > > Unsubscribe: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > <mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe> > > > _______________________________________________ > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > New messages to: [email protected] > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > <mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe> > _______________________________________________ > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > New messages to: [email protected] > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > <mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe> > _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: [email protected] Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe>
