As another lurker on this list, I agree with Theresa; the moderators should be proactive in making sure that the tone of the list stays constructive. This doesn't mean silencing dissent and criticism (which I don't think is the case here), but it does mean that there should be certain minimum standards of courtesy and good manners adhered to. I'm sure that no rudeness was intended, but sometimes through the medium of email it can come across that way, and it's worth taking an extra few moments to review what you write and make sure it can't be taken in the wrong way.
Being a mailing list admin must be a thankless job, so thanks to those who have taken on the job here for being proactive in this situation. Cheers, Craig On Mon, Apr 14, 2014 at 1:04 AM, Theresa Knott <[email protected]>wrote: > As someone who reads the list but rarely contributes, may I make a > suggestion? Moderators absolutely should pull people up for using an > inappropriate tone in their emails. However this should be done, in the > first instance, privately. > > Theresa > On 13 Apr 2014 15:58, "Fæ" <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Hi James, >> >> Thanks for chipping in as a moderator. I look forward to the >> moderators being just as critical with other contributors on this list >> when they are perceived to be snarky or bitchy, I am sure you wish to >> treat all contributors here equally. >> >> As Harry mentions, there have been many posts far worse than mine on >> this list, yet moderators have not felt the need to step in before. >> >> Fae >> >> On 13 April 2014 15:54, James Farrar <[email protected]> wrote: >> > No, Fae, I don't think that is obvious at all. It came across as snarky >> and >> > bitchy and Richard was well within his rights to call you on it. >> > >> > On 13 Apr 2014 15:52, "Fæ" <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >> >> Sure Harry, however I think it obvious that my email was not intended >> >> to be rude. Considering how rarely we see moderators of this list >> >> officially using their authority to criticise users, in fact I do not >> >> recall this happening in 2013 or 2014 until now, I find this >> >> incredibly odd. It seems reasonable to connect this sudden assumption >> >> of bad faith, to my recent posts to Wikimedia-l which raised the issue >> >> of the UK Chapter sending more people to the Wikimedia Conference this >> >> weekend than any other Chapter, including the hosts, with the >> >> inevitable response of being called a troll by one of the current >> >> trustees. >> >> >> >> The trend for the Chapter has been to stifle debate, as we have seen >> >> with how the Village Pump on the chapter wiki being reduced to >> >> announcements by employees and "positive statements" rather than open >> >> discussion of issues and problems. If this has started to extend to >> >> censorship of this list for vague perceptions of "tone" by Chapter >> >> employees, then I'm afraid that volunteers will end up writing >> >> anonymously on Wikipediocracy if they want to change anything or be >> >> heard. >> >> >> >> This list has always been presented as not managed by the Chapter. If >> >> the Chapter is now effectively controlling it, then I think it loses >> >> much of its value as a community sounding board. >> >> >> >> Fae >> >> >> >> On 13 April 2014 14:34, HJ Mitchell <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > Fae, >> >> > >> >> > I've seen worse emails to this list, but I can see Richard's point, >> >> > which is >> >> > that you could have written something to the effect of "Jon, would >> you >> >> > mind >> >> > including all the relevant information in your emails to the list", >> for >> >> > example, which has the same meaning but does not come across as >> >> > unnecessarily hostile. He wasn't asking you not to criticise, or not >> to >> >> > point out Jon's omission (if he was, I'd be jumping to your aid >> instead >> >> > of >> >> > Richard's), just to tone it down one notch for the benefit of >> everyone >> >> > else >> >> > subscribed to this list. >> >> > >> >> > Thanks, >> >> > >> >> > Harry Mitchell >> >> > http://enwp.org/User:HJ >> >> > Phone: 024 7698 0977 >> >> > Skype: harry_j_mitchell >> >> > On Sunday, 13 April 2014, 10:04, Fæ <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > No, I don't get it. >> >> > >> >> > Can someone please highlight exactly how this statement is >> unacceptably >> >> > rude? >> >> > "If you are going to repost emails to this list, please ensure you >> >> > include the relevant content." >> >> > >> >> > Fae >> >> > >> >> > On 13 April 2014 08:36, Richard Symonds >> >> > <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >> Hello all, >> >> >> >> >> >> I feel that as a list moderator I should step in and say that, for a >> >> >> second >> >> >> there, the tone of this list dropped needlessly. Fae, your email >> came >> >> >> across >> >> >> as rude: whether you meant it or not, that's how it came across. >> >> >> >> >> >> The main reason that this mailing list isn't much used by the >> general >> >> >> editing population is in my experience because the tone is hostile. >> >> >> That >> >> >> has >> >> >> to change if this list is to stay relevant and at the heart of the >> >> >> chapter >> >> >> and the UK movement. I accept that sometimes in real life hostility >> >> >> might >> >> >> be >> >> >> necessary in order to accomplish a goal, but I don't think that >> such a >> >> >> rule >> >> >> holds true on an internet mailing list. >> >> >> >> >> >> A reminder to us all (myself included) to put an extra bit of effort >> >> >> into >> >> >> being polite on the Internet. I don't want to stifle debate, and >> >> >> there's >> >> >> no >> >> >> problem with bad language if it's used to emphasise a point, but we >> can >> >> >> at >> >> >> least keep a friendly face on most emails. >> >> >> >> >> >> Complaints or comments should be addressed to the list moderators at >> >> >> [email protected] >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> >> Wikimedia UK mailing list >> >> >> [email protected] >> >> >> http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l >> >> >> WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > -- >> >> > [email protected] https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae >> >> > Personal and confidential, please do not circulate or re-quote. >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > _______________________________________________ >> >> > Wikimedia UK mailing list >> >> > [email protected] >> >> > http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l >> >> > WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > _______________________________________________ >> >> > Wikimedia UK mailing list >> >> > [email protected] >> >> > http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l >> >> > WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> [email protected] https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae >> >> Personal and confidential, please do not circulate or re-quote. >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Wikimedia UK mailing list >> >> [email protected] >> >> http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l >> >> WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk >> > >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Wikimedia UK mailing list >> > [email protected] >> > http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l >> > WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk >> >> >> >> -- >> [email protected] https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae >> Personal and confidential, please do not circulate or re-quote. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Wikimedia UK mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l >> WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk > > > _______________________________________________ > Wikimedia UK mailing list > [email protected] > http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l > WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk >
_______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [email protected] http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk
