[Winona Online Democracy] Keith,
It was not an inferred accusation. Let me be more direct. The staff and elected leadership of the City do not exactly have the highest marks when it comes to trust, respect for, and working with others, especially fellow local elected officials at any level. Did the City Manager or Mayor tell you of the possible conflict with the two events? Out for respect for other people's busy schedudes and their role as a fellow local elected official, the organizers of the Wilson Township Candidate Forum called two weeks before the scheduled event and asked for a good date for the Mayor to attend. If I'm correct, and please correct me if I'm inaccurate, the Mayor said he would not attend no matter when it was held. Then, shortly afterwards, your event is announced. I will readily admit that it may be a matter of a simple coincidence. But can you admit it at least looks funny at first glance? Back to the event itself. I'm glad it's going to happen but it might have been a great chance to reach out and build bridges with others. I had asked about some kind of community forum or panel back in early August. It was in the questions for the Joint City-County-Wilson Township Meeting that you and the City leaders all saw. I've been talking about this topic since early summer. Can we look at some kind of follow up panel or event to continue the study of the issue and to keep any possible momentum going? Even with all that, I don't want to get sidetracked from the main point of your original post -- the speaker you have set up. I'm willing to let those points be dropped so we can move on. About world population. You can create all kind of comparisons using stastistics. I had not heard the Minnesota one before. Still, do you believe the problem of increasing world population is a problem? I couldn't tell from your comparison. The question about future generations was not at all combative. On the contrary, it's an attempt to get at some deeper and, hopefully, more meatier discussions. The reason I asked those questions is that I want to see if you, or planners in general, realize there are natural, economical, and other limits to growth. You didn't answer the question about there being any times when growth or development shouldn't happen. Again, "Are there any times or places when or where growth (as in: getting bigger or expanding out) should not happen?" I strongly support change and improvement but I consider that very different from "growth." They are not mutually exclusive terms by any means but they are different aren't they? Lastly, I'd also like to see what others think or know about the concept of sustainability. Unfortunately, it seems to be a new or foreign concept to most people. It seems a bit like talking about the internet in the 1980's when some understood it and saw it coming but most hadn't yet heard about it. I believe it's a concept that the younger generations (and hopefully older generations too) will be forced to learn about and adjust to, sooner rather than later. Keith, do you consider the currrent city's growth and development plans sustainable? Dwayne October 15, 2004 -------- >Dwayne, > I would enjoy a discussion with out inferred accusations. >I had been directed as far back as late August to pursue this type of >information and presentation. After reviewing potential "experts" in >alternative storm water control and subdivision design I contacted Mr. >Rosumalksi. After an initial meeting we established a mutually >agreeable time for the discussion. Not a shred of deviousness entered >that process. ---enough of that discussion---- > > Again growth will happen. Human population continues to grow, >rural population continues to move to urban settings, and the number of >people per household continues to decrease. (speaking of world >population - did you know that if you could put every person in the >world in Minnesota they would each have 605 sf or a spot 24.6ft by >24.6ft, transportation would be slower than driving in Minneapolis) > > Again your question about should we consider future generations >is combative and does not promote healthy communication. Good planning >and the consideration of future and present generations is exactly what >we are talking about. The 30,000 of us that live together in this >community should be thankful that someone before us developed and built >on this spot so we can enjoy our homes and streets and neighborhoods. >We should do the same, and maybe even better. That is my goal. > >Keith Nelson > > >-----Original Message----- >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On >Behalf Of Dwayne Voegeli >Sent: Thursday, October 14, 2004 6:57 AM >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: RE: [Winona] Conservation Design of Subdivisions > >[Winona Online Democracy] > >Keith, > >The Wilson Town Board has been planning this candidate forum for weeks >and >has spoken with the Mayor and a few current City Council members about >it. > >Who planned your event? > >The timing looks a bit funny. > >Back to the forum. > >Again, the topic looks great. I wholeheartedly agree that we need to >develop better development models and planning. > >I hope you might consider other forums where others can also offer equal >input into who is on the panel and what is discussed ahead of time. > >Lastly, you said, "Growth will happen." > >Are there any times or places when or where growth should not happen? > >Should current developers and city planners take into account future >generations needs and long term affects? > >Dwayne Voegeli > >--------- > >> >>Dwayne, >> It is unfortunate that the Wilson Township board is having a >>meeting that evening. They have been invited to the presentation on >>Conservation Design of Subdivisions. No I did not know they were both >>scheduled for the same time. >> >>The discussion is not intended as a debate but as an opportunity to >>discover the options available for land development that protect, use >or >>even enhance the environment around us. I suspect that the proposals >>from Mr. Rozumalski will be controversial enough. The work that they >>put together as a guidance document for the Met Council, Minneapolis, >>St. Paul, and 3 or 4 watershed districts certainly is not design as >>usual. I hope we can get the Winona region to see Conservation Design >>as acceptable or even the norm. It's not "doze it", "pave it" and "put >>a house on it" anymore. >> >>Growth will happen. The natural world is ours to enjoy, use and >>protect. Let's combine the efforts. >> >>I hope you can make it on Oct 20 at 7:00, at City Hall. >> >>Keith Nelson >> >>-----Original Message----- >>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On >>Behalf Of Dwayne Voegeli >>Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2004 8:39 AM >>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>Subject: [Winona] Conservation Design of Subdivisions >> >>[Winona Online Democracy] >> >>Keith, >> >>The public presentation sounds like a great idea. >> >>But it's the same night that Wilson Township has set for a local >>government >>candidate's forum. Did you know that? >> >>Whenever the forum happens, what do you think about including a few >>other >>perspectives on the panel? Maybe 1-2 other speakers? >> >>Dwayne Voegeli >> >>October 13, 2004 >> >>----- >> >>> >>>[Winona Online Democracy] >>> >>> >>>Content-class: urn:content-classes:message >>>Content-Type: multipart/alternative; >>> boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C4B05A.71176712" >>> >>>________________________________ >>> >>> >>> >>>With recent discussions on the development of area lands and the >>>controversy that naturally follows, the City of Winona will be hosting >>a >>>public presentation and discussion on "Conservation Design for >>>Subdivisions". Fred Rozumalski, Landscape Ecologist with Barr >>>Engineering Company, will discuss successful solutions and available >>>options for the development and preservation of the landscape that is >>>unique to the Winona region. >>> >>> >>> >>>Mr. Rozumalski was the project manager of the "Minnesota Urban Small >>>Sites Best Management Practices Manual". >>> >>> >>> >>>The presentation and discussion will be Wednesday, October 20, at 7:00 >>>P.M. in the Council Chambers, 207 Lafayette St, Winona. >>> >>> >>> >>>A public notice has been sent to electronically to local media. Paper >>>copies will also be sent to involved individuals and organizations. >>> >>> >>> >>>Keith Nelson >>> >>>Winona, Minnesota >>>507 457 8274 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>><html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" >>>xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" >>>xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" >>>xmlns:st1="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" >>>xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40";> >>> >>><head> >>><meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> >>><meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 11 (filtered medium)"> >>><!--[if !mso]> >>><style> >>>v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} >>>o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} >>>w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} >>>.shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);} >>></style> >>><![endif]--><o:SmartTagType >>> namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" >name="place" >>> downloadurl="http://www.5iantlavalamp.com/"/> >>><o:SmartTagType >>namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" >>> name="City"/> >>><o:SmartTagType >>namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" >>> name="State"/> >>><o:SmartTagType >>namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" >>> name="Street"/> >>><o:SmartTagType >>namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" >>> name="address"/> >>><!--[if !mso]> >>><style> >>>st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) } >>></style> >>><![endif]--> >>><style> >>><!-- >>> /* Font Definitions */ >>> @font-face >>> {font-family:"Palatino Linotype"; >>> panose-1:2 4 5 2 5 5 5 3 3 4;} >>> /* Style Definitions */ >>> p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal >>> {margin:0in; >>> margin-bottom:.0001pt; >>> font-size:10.0pt; >>> font-family:"Times New Roman";} >>>a:link, span.MsoHyperlink >>> {color:blue; >>> text-decoration:underline;} >>>a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed >>> {color:purple; >>> text-decoration:underline;} >>>p >>> {mso-margin-top-alt:auto; >>> margin-right:0in; >>> mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto; >>> margin-left:0in; >>> font-size:12.0pt; >>> font-family:"Times New Roman";} >>>span.EmailStyle18 >>> {mso-style-type:personal; >>> font-family:Arial; >>> color:maroon; >>> font-weight:normal; >>> font-style:normal; >>> text-decoration:none none;} >>>span.EmailStyle19 >>> {mso-style-type:personal-reply; >>> font-family:Arial; >>> color:blue; >>> font-weight:normal; >>> font-style:normal; >>> text-decoration:none none;} >>>@page Section1 >>> {size:8.5in 11.0in; >>> margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in;} >>>div.Section1 >>> {page:Section1;} >>>--> >>></style> >>> >>></head> >>> >>><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple> >>> >>><div class=Section1> >>> >>><div> >>> >>><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font >>size=3 >>>face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> >>> >>><hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1> >>> >>></span></font></div> >>> >>></div> >>> >>><p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face="Times New Roman"><span >>style='font-size: >>>10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p> >>> >>><p class=MsoNormal style='text-autospace:none'><font size=3 >>face=Arial><span >>>style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'>With recent discussions on >>the >>>development of area lands and the controversy that naturally follows, >>the City >>>of <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City >>w:st="on">Winona</st1:City></st1:place> will >>>be hosting a public presentation and discussion on "Conservation >>Design >>>for Subdivisions". Fred Rozumalski, Landscape Ecologist >with >>Barr >>>Engineering Company, will discuss successful solutions and available >>options >>>for the development and preservation of the landscape that is unique >to >>>the <st1:place >>>w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on">Winona</st1:City></st1:place> >>>region.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p> >>> >>><p class=MsoNormal style='text-autospace:none'><font size=3 >>face=Arial><span >>>style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p> </o:p></span></f >o >>nt></p> >>> >>><p class=MsoNormal style='text-autospace:none'><font size=3 >>face=Arial><span >>>style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Mr. Rozumalski was the >>project >>>manager of the "Minnesota Urban Small Sites Best Management >>Practices >>>Manual".<o:p></o:p></span></font></p> >>> >>><p class=MsoNormal style='text-autospace:none'><font size=3 >>face=Arial><span >>>style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p> </o:p></span></f >o >>nt></p> >>> >>><p class=MsoNormal style='text-autospace:none'><font size=3 >>face=Arial><span >>>style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'>The presentation and >>discussion will >>>be Wednesday, October 20, at 7:00 P.M. in the Council Chambers, >><st1:address >>>w:st="on"><st1:Street w:st="on">207 Lafayette St</st1:Street>, >><st1:City >>>w:st="on">Winona</st1:City></st1:address>.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p >> >>> >>><p class=MsoNormal style='text-autospace:none'><font size=3 >>face=Arial><span >>>style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p> </o:p></span></f >o >>nt></p> >>> >>><p class=MsoNormal style='text-autospace:none'><font size=3 >>face=Arial><span >>>style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'>A public notice has been >>sent to >>>electronically to local media. Paper copies will also be sent to >>involved >>>individuals and organizations. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> >>> >>><p class=MsoNormal style='text-autospace:none'><font size=3 >>face=Arial><span >>>style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p> </o:p></span></f >o >>nt></p> >>> >>><p><i><font size=3 color=maroon face="Palatino Linotype"><span >>>style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Palatino Linotype";color:maroon; >>>font-style:italic'>Keith Nelson <o:p></o:p></span></font></i></p> >>> >>><p><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on"><i><font size=3 >>color=maroon >>> face="Palatino Linotype"><span >>>style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Palatino Linotype"; >>> >>color:maroon;font-style:italic'>Winona</span></font></i></st1:City><i>< >f >>ont >>> color=maroon face="Palatino Linotype"><span >>style='font-family:"Palatino >>>Linotype"; >>> color:maroon;font-style:italic'>, <st1:State >>>w:st="on">Minnesota</st1:State></span></font></i></st1:place><font >>>color=maroon><span style='color:maroon'> <br> >>></span></font><i><font color=maroon face="Palatino Linotype"><span >>>style='font-family:"Palatino >>Linotype";color:maroon;font-style:italic'>507 457 >>>8274</span></font></i><font color=maroon><span style='color:maroon'> >>></span></font><i><font >>>color=maroon face="Palatino Linotype"><span >>style='font-family:"Palatino >>>Linotype"; >>>color:maroon;font-style:italic'><o:p></o:p></span></font></i></p> >>> >>><p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face="Times New Roman"><span >>style='font-size: >>>10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p> >>> >>></div> >>> >>></body> >>> >>></html> >>> >>>_______________________________________________ >>>This message was posted to Winona Online Democracy >>>All messages must be signed by the senders actual name. >>>No commercial solicitations are allowed on this list. >>>To manage your subscription or view the message archives, please visit >>>http://mapnp.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/winona >>>Any problems or suggestions can be directed to >>>mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>If you want help on how to contact elected officials, go to the >Contact >>page at >>> http://www.winonaonlinedemocracy.org >>> >> >>------------ >> >>Dwayne Voegeli >> >>Winona County Commissioner >> >>(507) 453-9012 >> >>[EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >>359 Pleasant Hill Dr. >>Winona, MN 55987 >> >>------------ >> >> >>_______________________________________________ >>This message was posted to Winona Online Democracy >>All messages must be signed by the senders actual name. >>No commercial solicitations are allowed on this list. >>To manage your subscription or view the message archives, please visit >>http://mapnp.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/winona >>Any problems or suggestions can be directed to >>mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >>If you want help on how to contact elected officials, go to the Contact >>page at >> http://www.winonaonlinedemocracy.org >>_______________________________________________ >>This message was posted to Winona Online Democracy >>All messages must be signed by the senders actual name. >>No commercial solicitations are allowed on this list. >>To manage your subscription or view the message archives, please visit >>http://mapnp.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/winona >>Any problems or suggestions can be directed to >>mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >>If you want help on how to contact elected officials, go to the Contact >page at >> http://www.winonaonlinedemocracy.org >> > >------------ > >Dwayne Voegeli > >Winona County Commissioner > >(507) 453-9012 > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] > >359 Pleasant Hill Dr. >Winona, MN 55987 > >------------ > > >_______________________________________________ >This message was posted to Winona Online Democracy >All messages must be signed by the senders actual name. >No commercial solicitations are allowed on this list. >To manage your subscription or view the message archives, please visit >http://mapnp.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/winona >Any problems or suggestions can be directed to >mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >If you want help on how to contact elected officials, go to the Contact >page at > http://www.winonaonlinedemocracy.org ------------ Dwayne Voegeli Winona County Commissioner (507) 453-9012 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 359 Pleasant Hill Dr. Winona, MN 55987 ------------ _______________________________________________ This message was posted to Winona Online Democracy All messages must be signed by the senders actual name. No commercial solicitations are allowed on this list. To manage your subscription or view the message archives, please visit http://mapnp.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/winona Any problems or suggestions can be directed to mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you want help on how to contact elected officials, go to the Contact page at http://www.winonaonlinedemocracy.org
