I agree that CBP should not have been a requirement for the hardware. A "listen before you speak" protocol makes some bad assumptions about the chances of a successful packet delivery. For example, on a longer PTP link, just because there is noise at the transmitter, it does not mean that there is the same noise at the receiver. On the other hand, there may be a client that is trying to receive that is right next to the transmitter, and it may not be detected by a listen-before-speak protocol.
I do agree with a provision to mandate cooperation (although the effectiveness or enforcement of this could be debated). At least this is encouraging parties to work together and in fact is usually in their best interest to work together. -Hal -----Original Message----- From: Tom DeReggi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Reply-To: WISPA General List <wireless@wispa.org> To: WISPA General List <wireless@wispa.org> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Update from the FCC on 3.65Ghz and CBP Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2008 03:53:53 -0500 Just to clarify my last post... I was not supportive in all 50Mhz being allocated to "WiMax". I was supportive in all 50Mhz being allocated without the contention protocol requirement, So there would be 50 contiguous mhz for a common platform. Not requiring contention base, still allows choice of platform and technology, it just doesn't restrict platforms, nor protect any.. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband ----- Original Message ----- From: "Harold Bledsoe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 2:19 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Update from the FCC on 3.65Ghz and CBP >I respectfully disagree. In my opinion, any frequency that is tied to a > particular standard by regulation will do nothing but stifle innovation > in that band. > > -Hal > > -----Original Message----- > From: John Scrivner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Reply-To: WISPA General List <wireless@wispa.org> > To: WISPA General List <wireless@wispa.org> > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Update from the FCC on 3.65Ghz and CBP > Date: Tue, 1 Jul 2008 16:14:48 -0500 > > I would like to see WiMax approved for the entire 50 MHz and do away > with the contention mechanism requirement for the upper 25 MHz as > required under the rules. I know this is a flip-flop of position from > our earlier position but frankly I see this as a god opportunity for > WISPs to move up to the next level of reliability and scale. Many > people are building in WiMax with success in the 3.5 to 3.8 GHz bands > across the world. If WiMax were the standard for the 3650 band across > 50 MHz then carriers could easily work together to band plan and move > away from interference. With GPS sync the bands can be reused multiple > times anyway. Sticking with one standard in this band just makes sense > for us. It can be a "WISP band" if we do this. Spanking more out of > 802.11 is old news and needs to be put to bed. It is time to use a > real platform for scalable and reliable outdoor wireless broadband. > WiMax is the path to this in 3.65 GHz. 802.22 will be the standard in > the TV whitespaces (hopefully). It is time for us to standardize and > use something better than repurposed WiFi. > Scriv > > > > > On Tue, Jul 1, 2008 at 10:15 AM, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> The energy level for backoff CAN be adjusted. >> >> The FCC says that NEITHER is acceptable, and even though the atheros >> mechanism is just an "energy detection", it will not be allowed. This >> is >> what I gathered from an assortment of emails on the topic, some of which >> were from the FCC to someone wanting certification. >> >> >> >> >> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >> <insert witty tagline here> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Harold Bledsoe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> >> Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2008 4:52 AM >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Update from the FCC on 3.65Ghz and CBP >> >> >>> The RF energy detection mechanism of 802.11a is sort of based on power >>> level. If the preamble is detected and decoded, then the mechanism is >>> activated at -82dBm. Otherwise it requires a relatively high energy >>> level (-62dBm). >>> >>> Although I agree that even -62dBm seems "fair". It would be very useful >>> to know what part of the CCA mechanism of 802.11a does not work for the >>> FCC's contention requirement. If it is not the detection mechanism, >>> then perhaps it is the backoff mechanism? >>> >>> -Hal >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>> Reply-To: WISPA General List <wireless@wispa.org> >>> To: WISPA General List <wireless@wispa.org> >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Update from the FCC on 3.65Ghz and CBP >>> Date: Tue, 1 Jul 2008 01:23:31 -0700 >>> >>> That's nice, but in real life the FCC has simply gotten on a tear and >>> decided that NOTHING qualifies for what they want. >>> >>> I have no idea what the purpose of this rather odd bit of nonsense is >>> about, >>> but when it declares that 802.11 "does not detect dissimilar systems", >>> then >>> nothing can EVER be made to work. After all, the whole "listen before >>> talk" >>> is AN RF ENERGY DETECTOR. If that doesn't work, nothing can. Or, >>> only >>> that device or mechanism the person passing judgement wants to promote >>> will >>> "work". >>> >>> We would spectulate who has bought this favor from the FCC, but in >>> reality, >>> it doesn't matter. I predict NO equipment will be certified for the >>> rest >>> of >>> the spectrum and it will be auctioned for big bucks to some large >>> entity. >>> We'll still be in the same boat 2 years from now, with statements about >>> "we're watching the development of <insert technology du jour here> with >>> interest". >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>> <insert witty tagline here> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> To: "'WISPA General List'" <wireless@wispa.org> >>> Sent: Monday, June 30, 2008 4:28 PM >>> Subject: [WISPA] Update from the FCC on 3.65Ghz and CBP >>> >>> >>>> Update from the FCC. This makes is very clear to me what the FCC is >>>> looking >>>> for, if there are any questions or comments feel free. >>>> >>>> Sincerely, Tony Morella >>>> Demarc Technology Group, A Wireless Solution Provider >>>> Office: 207-667-7583 Fax: 207-433-1008 >>>> http://www.demarctech.com >>>> >>>> >>>> "Tony: >>>> Thank you for your inquiry. >>>> >>>> In the email you mentioned that several companies have obtained >>>> equipment >>>> authorization for operation in the lower 25 MHz of the 3650-3700 MHz >>>> band. >>>> This is correct. In the Commission's evaluation these devices met the >>>> requirements for restricted contention based protocol operation. Thus >>>> all >>>> of these devices support contention based protocol, but they only >>>> support >>>> that for similar types of systems. They do not provide for recognizing >>>> and >>>> coexistence with other dissimilar systems. >>>> >>>> In order to obtain the authorization for the full 50 MHz operation the >>>> system has to demonstrate coexistence with different protocols. At the >>>> present time the Commission reviews each application on its merit to >>>> determine if the system meets the requirements for such unrestricted >>>> operation. The Commission is monitoring the progress of IEEE 802.16h >>>> and >>>> 802.11y working groups in terms of their plans to extend their >>>> respective >>>> protocols to support coexistence. We are encouraged by this >>>> development >>>> and >>>> think that they are in the right direction. However, it is not a >>>> precondition for authorization. In the absence of any industry >>>> standard, >>>> we >>>> treat each application on a case-by-case basis. One of the tests we do >>>> apply is the co-existence analysis recommendation currently under >>>> review >>>> by >>>> the 802.19 committee. We would expect to see some simulation to show >>>> how >>>> the proposed system would behave in the presence of other systems, the >>>> back-off strategies employed and approaches to fair sharing mechanisms. >>>> >>>> Please let us know if you have further questions. >>>> Thank you, >>>> Rashmi Doshi, PhD >>>> Chief, FCC Laboratory Division" >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- WISPA Wants You! 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