With the power of Google and those skills I totally agree as well. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Feb 29, 2012 9:34 AM, "Simon Westlake" <si...@powercode.com> wrote:
> Yeah, and that's the thing I don't like about very specific questions > because, honestly, who cares if you do as long as you understand the > concept. If I'd say to someone 'what's the subnet mask for a /25' or > something like that and they answered 'I don't remember off the top of my > head but I can figure it out in 2 minutes if you give me some paper or a > subnet calculator' I'd check it off as 'passed' - same deal with things > like the Cisco questions if they answered 'Umm, I'd do show ip ospf then > tab a couple of times until I found the right command, I don't remember > exactly' > > Troubleshooting questions are the gold ones, I don't remember off the top > of my head all the syntax of how to build an access list to control prefix > advertisement through BGP on a Cisco but I could tell you what you need to > do to do it and I think that is way more important in a hire - do they know > concepts and can they figure stuff out. > > On 2/29/2012 5:54 AM, Matt Hoppes wrote: > > I always liked situational troubleshooting ones because I use a subnet > calculator :P > > > > On Feb 28, 2012, at 23:37, "Simon Westlake" <si...@powercode.com> wrote: > > Well, I think some of the ones I mentioned are alright. It depends if > you're hiring tech support or a network engineer but for mid-level tech > support/pseudo engineer type role I'd ask things like: > > What is a subnet mask? > If they got that one.. what is a /29 subnet mask? > If I told you a subnet was 192.168.10.0/25, what is the network and > broadcast IP? Name one usable IP in this range. > > Usually lets you know if they understand subnetting. I've had people break > out pencil and paper and do it binary style - at least they know how but > lets you know they learned it in a book, they don't do it regularly. Not > good or bad just useful info. > > The NAT/port forwarding one I mentioned earlier I always found useful, > lets you know how their brain works when troubleshooting. You could > probably expand this to wireless (you put up an access point, connected > user has 4 bars, next day they have 2 bars, how would you start > troubleshooting?) > > I always liked the situational ones because anyone can memorize how to > subnet but what you really want is someone with a good logical brain for > solving problems. > > I used to ask some about ports (e.g. what port does SMTP run on, what > protocol typically runs on port 110), I'd ask things like 'how do you see > the status of all OSPF neighbors in a Cisco router', maybe not so important > if you don't use Cisco gear but you can ask general questions in that case > (what does cost do in an OSPF, for example.) > > How would you identify/troubleshoot a speed/duplex problem on an Ethernet > interface.. describe how you'd make an Ethernet cable (bonus points if they > know T-568A and B but who cares, really, it's more about if they know how > and they can tell you.. double bonus if they end with 'and then I get out > my tester and make sure the cable is good before I plug it in').. what is > the difference between single and multimode fiber.. > > Really, I just used to think about the things I used to have to deal with > on a daily basis and tried to construct scenarios out of them. If I > couldn't, I'd just ask a specific question. I will say, the scenario type > questions are by far the best. Someone who has done their A+ might memorize > a bunch of data but they can't always put it into practice. So, I'd just > lay out 10 problems you've had to solve or try to brainstorm a few and > write them down from simplest to hardest. If they can't answer the first > 2-3, you're probably done. The NAT one was a good opener (web server on > private IP, why can't external access it, etc), I'd do some stuff like > computer X is plugged into a switch with an IP of 192.168.10.5, subnet mask > 255.255.255.128, why can't he ping 192.168.10.253 255.255.255.128? > > Throw a bunch of questions in the middle like 'what's your favorite > Android 'phone' or 'what video game did you last play' to keep them loose > and not too stressed out. > > I used to have to do this a lot and I ended up winging it at the end a lot > of the time. Once you've done 20-30 interviews, you can figure out > someone's technical ability pretty quickly. The hard part is figuring out > if they are going to be a giant pain in the ass in 3 months. > > ------------------------------ > *From*: "Josh Luthman" <j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> > *Sent*: Tuesday, February 28, 2012 5:18 PM > *To*: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> > *Subject*: Re: [WISPA] New employee quiz > > I agree on who to hire, but I don't have the brain to come up with > those questions to weed out the first set! > > Josh Luthman > Office: 937-552-2340 > Direct: 937-552-2343 > 1100 Wayne St > Suite 1337 > Troy, OH 45373 > > > > On Tue, Feb 28, 2012 at 6:12 PM, Simon Westlake <si...@powercode.com> > wrote: > > I just dug for it, doesn't look like I kept it, sorry - it's probably > > languishing in a file cabinet in Milwaukee. I wrote it for TWC when I > > worked there since the HR interviews were generally things like 'Why do > > you like sunshine?' and 'What is your favorite color of hair?' so they > > kept hiring people who had 'good' resumes but zero actual knowledge. > > > > The funny thing there was that the kind of resumes I throw in the > > garbage here (skills: Microsoft Word, Microsoft Excel, Adobe Acrobat, > > Notepad, Calculator, Pacman, Windows Start Menu, JPEG, CPU, > > Keyboard/Mouse, etc) got through most of the screening there because > > they could check off 'Knows Microsoft Word, knows Pacman' and pass it on > > as a stellar resume. The guys who wrote things like 'Built a flux > > capacitor out of spare motherboards, constructed a satellite dish out of > > cardboard to watch Iranian TV, write assembly in the bathroom' never > > made it through because they didn't know Microsoft Word. > > > > So, I had to come up with something to screen out the first crowd and > > make sure the second were what they said they were. The stuff I said > > below was the gist of it, it was a mix of specific knowledge (e.g. what > > is a subnet mask) and situation based stuff (I can't remember the harder > > parts but the simpler stuff was things like 'Customer X has a router, we > > are giving them a public IP of 1.2.3.4, he has a web server behind the > > router that is set to 192.168.10.2. He can get to the server inside his > > network if he opens 192.168.10.2 in a web browser but nobody going to > > 1.2.3.4 can see the web page. Why?') > > > > If they made it through the first couple of pages, I had a harder sheet > > that I honestly don't remember much of but it was probably a mix to see > > where their skills lay (some routing protocol questions, probably some > > protocol specific/packet capturing type stuff for the troubleshooting > > scenarios, etc) along with some vendor specific stuff (how do you do X > > in a Cisco since we were a 100% Cisco shop). If they didn't make it > > through the first page, I just smiled, said thanks and everyone had an > > easier day. > > > > It worked pretty well apart from the fact that already nervous people > > would often have a meltdown if they flunked the first few questions. It > > was also a good way to know what peoples weak spots were if you did end > > up hiring them (e.g. they failed all the Cisco questions or they knew > > nothing about OSPF) but it was mostly just to get a good baseline on > > whether or not someone could do the job. > > > > Nowadays I end up hiring more based on aptitude, personality and desire > > to learn than anything else, knowledge isn't everything. Granted, if you > > are hiring a programmer, they need a certain level of knowledge but I'd > > rather have someone who has 75% of the knowledge and 150% of the > > attitude than vice versa. Hard thing to pick out a lot of the time > > though. I'm just waiting for someone to invent a robot that can write > > good code. When we hire for Powercode, I normally give people a couple > > of functions to write (e.g. write a recursive function that reverses a > > string and returns it) and see how they come to a conclusion and do some > > design exercises with them (lately we've been doing one based around > > building online card games.) Same kind of idea.. you might have a > > Bachelors in Software Development but if you can't write a recursive > > function to reverse a string, I don't really care. > > > > The TL;DR of this essay is that I hate hiring, it's a pain in the ass. > > > > On 2/28/2012 1:45 PM, Josh Luthman wrote: > >> Ooo care to share??? > >> > >> Josh Luthman > >> Office: 937-552-2340 > >> Direct: 937-552-2343 > >> 1100 Wayne St > >> Suite 1337 > >> Troy, OH 45373 > >> > >> > >> > >> On Tue, Feb 28, 2012 at 2:35 PM, Simon Westlake<si...@powercode.com> > wrote: > >>> Are you looking for networking stuff, wireless stuff or both? > >>> > >>> I wrote one a while back that was mostly things like 'What is a subnet > mask' > >>> or 'What's the difference between an IP address and a MAC address?' > >>> > >>> A lot of the time people would get them wrong (depending on skill > level) but > >>> you could generally pick out the people who had a clue/had some > ability by > >>> their thought process in trying to figure it out if they didn't know. > >>> > >>> > >>> On 2/28/2012 9:46 AM, Andy Trimmell wrote: > >>> > >>> I found a decent website for online quizzes. Just looking to see what > kind > >>> of questions people would go with. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org > >>> [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org<wireless-boun...@wispa.org>] > On > >>> Behalf Of Josh Luthman > >>> Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2012 9:24 AM > >>> To: WISPA General List > >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] New employee quiz > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> Jay maybe? > >>> > >>> Josh Luthman > >>> Office: 937-552-2340 > >>> Direct: 937-552-2343 > >>> 1100 Wayne St > >>> Suite 1337 > >>> Troy, OH 45373 > >>> > >>> On Feb 28, 2012 9:15 AM, "Andy Trimmell"<atrimm...@precisionds.com> > wrote: > >>> > >>> I know a few months back someone was very happy with their online quiz > they > >>> had for new employees to take before interviewing them. They got it > from > >>> another WISP and was looking for the same thing. Looking to hire > someone > >>> else and need some kind of quiz to weed out the useless people for the > job. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> Anyone know? > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> Andy Trimmell > >>> > >>> Network Administrator > >>> > >>> atrimm...@precisionds.com > >>> > >>> 317.831.3000 ext 211 > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Wireless mailing list > >>> Wireless@wispa.org > >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Wireless mailing list > >>> Wireless@wispa.org > >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Simon Westlake > >>> Powercode.com > >>> (920) 351-1010 > >>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Wireless mailing list > >>> Wireless@wispa.org > >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > >>> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Wireless mailing list > >> Wireless@wispa.org > >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > > > -- > > Simon Westlake > > Powercode.com > > (920) 351-1010 > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wireless mailing list > > Wireless@wispa.org > > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > _______________________________________________ > Wireless mailing list > Wireless@wispa.org > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > _______________________________________________ > Wireless mailing list > Wireless@wispa.org > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > > -- > Simon Westlake > Powercode.com(920) 351-1010 > > > _______________________________________________ > Wireless mailing list > Wireless@wispa.org > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > >
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