well i must just again raise my disapointment in the manner in which funerals have been reduced to factional platforms where those who support either course shine.we have disrespected many of our comrades funerals by continuing with this behaviour.comrade george you have just attacked cde mdu on the basis that he raised principle,which you view as supporting the faceless comrade. well i dont think people should wait for funerals in order to assess leader's perfomance. cadres should go to conferences and positively contribute in the building of the organisation.i want people to categorically tell us were the previous leadership of SASCO failed and were the Current is excelling. all those who allege that the previous leadership of SASCO failed are like the very same faceless sasco member because their assessment is based on their failure to influence the election outcomes of the conferences that elected previous leadership.if it was people that they wanted they would be singing a different tune.well how is the Right To Learn Campaign doing?
Engage the thought not the Origin!!! On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 2:37 PM, KGALE GODFREY MAILA <[email protected]>wrote: > > > "when do lies become truth? Is it NOT when one intends to deceive? > > You see Sibusisiwe > > Before i tell you that sasco memeber tells first hand info, let me tell > you what is a big problem: > > I read your input three times, i agree with you fully. But the issues > is that: The only problem of downgrading other cadres' views and reduce > them to nothing in this forum has been caused by Kaizer Mohau - to the > extend of "instructing" Dominic to delete those who disagree with his > views. now the problem is that most of you agree with his views, [maybe > for fear of being deleted from the forum], even if they are factually > incorrect. > > Since Polokwane, he has taken it upon himself to insult those he > suspects of being sympathetic to a wrong agenda. Just because he > "suspects", does not make him more correct to huddle insults into these > cadres, moreover, using this forum. He has adopted this syndrome of > being a memeber of other member of the ANC instead of being a memeber of > the ANC himself. It appears to me that he feels more member of the ANC > than us, thats why you now have these views of Super Ministers in the > coming government. Have you ever seen such a thing in the ANC called > super-something > > Just read what he [Kaizer] says here in response to Sasco memeber: > > "Let Thabo Mbeki's financial backers upgrade your "Friends of > democracy" website to > enable you to engage us, this is not your platform". > > "SASCO, as we know in terms of the previous leadership, differed with > the broad revolutionary movement in terms of how we should engage the > class project - and therefore we beileve that the previous leadership > operated as the semi-educated drum majarretes of the 1996 class > project". > > This is not only one thing he said in the past 13 months, as I write > here, I have his 17 printed inputs which says nothing about the broader > transformation agenda in wich the 52nd National conference has placed a > responsibility on all of us -MDM -to engage and ensure its success, > rather, a rhetoric assertions about this or that, snakes, dogs, domza > delete and so forth. > > this is one comrade [Kaizer] i know from when he was at Cosatu House, > very principled, but completely changed to what i cannot describe in > words. Maybe he thinks in him is what Polokwane represents!! > > With regard to Sasco Member, I was there in that funeral having > solicited a lift from Mpumalanga delegation, I can confirm all what > Sasco Member is saying in so far as Khaye speech is concerned, very > unfortunate indeed. > > We are all equall memebers of the ANC led alliance, no fear, no > apology. Let us support factual debate, not just support because a > person is Kaizer Mohau. > > Funky Maila > Mpumalanga Province > > > >>> [email protected] 01/27/09 2:20 PM >>> > Com > > I was tempted not to respond to your email but I think I have every > right to respond to issues as you have correctly done so. If you read > my > submission attentively you will notice that I am not expelling anyone > from this forum neither am I agreeing or disagreeing with the > assertions > of "sasco member" at any point. In fact I said that if indeed events > unfolded in the manner and context that the comrade alleges then I may > be inclined to agree that the platform was inappropriate to discuss > such, but as. My submission is that the cadre should raise his point > without launching an attack on individuals. > > The point of this forum is not to HOWL but rather to convince us of > his > views...I doubt anyone here holds the monopoly on views of SASCO > leadership (previous and otherwise) but you will excuse me if I am not > inclined to read endless rhetoric about Clique politics of SASCO from > one "SASCO member". > > Chief if you want to engage on whether the SASCO leadership before > Umtata was relevant or not then we can do that, but I for one will not > be roped into a discussion on ANY personalities - it is highly > unprincipled and divisive. > > So really com, review peoples submissions before you Giraffe and want > to > randomly chow for no reason what so ever - the fundamental issue is > that > this forum will not be abused by people with scores to settle. > > ________________________________ > > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Mduduzi H > Vilakazi > Sent: 27 January 2009 12:07 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: [YCLSA Discussion] Is the space really closed for > engagements? > > > > Dear Cadres! > > > > This letter refers to the discussion around comrade Khaye Nkwanyana. I > want to refrain from discussing personalities and engage the issues > that > arise from the discussion. > > > > Sibusisiwe, Njabulo, Sandile and the energetic Kaizer you all sound > bitter than the faceless sasco member who hides his/her identity due > to > cowardice. Your responses to the headless sasco member exposes your > one > size-fit-all approach to this matter. > > > > The main issue at hand is whether all previous SASCO leadership > collectives since the 6th of September 1991 to the Mthatha Conference > did not serve SASCO well. It does not matter whether the toothless > sasco > member is true or whether Khaye raised such issues but the issue is > before us to discuss. > > > > What yardstic can we use to determine the performance of previous > sasco > membership. Will the congress resolutions juxtaposed with the > organizational and political reports in the following conference be > enough to determine perfomance? Were we in SASCO between 1991 and 2000 > to such an extent that we can talk about the behaviour of the > leadership > then? > > > > The other issue that pops in is the question of subscription to the > YCL-discussion forum. When I subscribed nothing more than my e-mail > address was needed. I just added my willingness to participate in the > forum. > > > > Cde Kaizer and others who dismisses other subscribers in the forum > should clarify us where did they get that mandate. What requirements > of > subscription is required other than an e-mail address. Their > unwillingness to tolerate views that they do not share gives one an > understanding that they lack political maturity. The only way they can > get their "yes" men and "yes" women is to dismiss those who contest > their views. > > > > I think, I should strongly lash at SASCO member who raise issues > without > providing his/her identity. Cde Matimba wrote at the end his name > because his address (unlike ours) does not provide the details. Cde > Sascomember shall learn from the likes of comrade Matimba. The > headless-chicken approach is a political cowardice. It makes me to > believe that he/she is the extreme liar without doubt. He/she has > first > and foremost lied about his identity while giving names of those > he/she > draws reference from. > > > > However, this forum does not belong to Kaizer Mohau, Sibusisiwe > Sibiya, > Njabulo Nzuza and Sandile Dayi. If they cannot engage issues, they > must > refrain fro expelling people from this forum, we need all voices. This > forum teaches all of us, how will we learn if we are chased away by > the > likes of Sandile and them. > > > > Let the debates continue... > > > > This message and any attachments relating to official business of the > Mpumalanga Provincial Government (MPG) is proprietary to the MPG and > intended for the original addressee only. The message may contain > information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. Any > views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender. If > you receive this message in error, please notify the original sender > immediately and destroy the original message. If you are not the > intended recipient of this message, you are hereby notified that you > must not disseminate, copy, use, distribute, or take any action in > connection therewith. The MPG cannot insure that the integrity of this > communication has been maintained, nor that it is free of errors, > viruses, interception and / or interference. The MPG is not liable > whatsoever for loss or damage resulting from the opening of this > message > and / or attachments and / or the use of the information contained in > this message and / or attachments. > > <http://www.mpumalanga.gov.za> > > > > ***************************************************************************** > The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and may > be subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, > you must not use, copy, distribute or disclose the e-mail or any > part of its contents or take any action in reliance on it. If you have > > received this e-mail in error, please e-mail the sender by replying > to this message. All reasonable precautions have been taken to > ensure no viruses are present in this e-mail and the sender cannot > accept responsibility for loss or damage arising from the use of this > e-mail or attachments. > > .***************************************************************************** > > > > > > -- Yours Sincerely Senzo Ncongolo 0743618139 --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You are subscribed. This footer can help you. Please POST your comments to [email protected] or reply to this message. You can visit the group WEB SITE at http://groups.google.com/group/yclsa-eom-forum for different delivery options, pages, files and membership. To UNSUBSCRIBE, please email [email protected] . You don't have to put anything in the "Subject:" field. You don't have to put anything in the message part. All you have to do is to send an e-mail to this address (repeat): [email protected] . -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
