Cde Vincent, you seem to be arguing at cross-purposes. I'm unable to agree or disagree with your posting because I cannot find your point of difference except that you provided a new translation to the argument I'm raising. You say "Who is the new cadre and where is it from?" At the same time you argue that "We are all not perfect and perhaps the rot you are seeing cde Morgan others are not seeing as rot but certain elements and qualities of leadership." I did not argue perfection but negative tendencies that have eroded the character, principles, core values and culture of the ANC such as ill-discipline and factionalism. I do not know these "certain elements" and what "qualities of leadership" are you referring to. You're arguing in parallel. Let me help you unpack the rot as well as a new calibre of cadres and leaders. Cde Mantashe in his organisational report, alluded to the "new culture" of block voting, saying it was based on "slates" of candidates, which compromised the democratic nature of the ANC's leadership elections and "denied the organisation capable leaders". And further highlighted that the ANC was now regarded as an employment agency that people joined to gain access to resources. Also on the special NEC held in Tshwane, cde Mantashe said "Our failure to act against all forms of ill-discipline will result in us losing the respect that the ANC has within the South African society, within SADC, within the continent and in the rest of the world." Now cde Vincent, I doubt if "others" do not see that this situation calls for the branches to redefine a cadre and a leader in the ANC, and so is their impact on the ANC political culture and society at large. Not unless you want to debate semantics to hide your myopism. Cde Makhura didn't just say "The ANC is a patient and it is sick, it needs intervention" out of a vacuum. Unless, you're suggesting a no-intervention approach with a hope that branches will cross the bridge when they get to it? Asikhulume! Morgan
"Sometimes, if you wear suits for too long, it changes your ideology." - Joe Slovo --- On Thu, 1/19/12, Vincent Masoga <[email protected]> wrote: From: Vincent Masoga <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [YCLSA Discussion] ANC National Officials: Issue of the Treasurer General of the ANC and other matters To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> Date: Thursday, January 19, 2012, 8:48 AM Who is the new cadre and where is it from? We are all not perfect and perhaps the rot you are seeing cde Morgan others are not seeing as rot but certain elements and qualities of leadership. There is no perfect sant who is coming to save the ANC. In fact I differ with insinuations that the organization is rotten, the organization still stands, leaders come and go. So I believe that the current leadership of the ANC majority in the NEC is trying by all means to cultivate discipline and the above average moral standards to be selfless and dedicate their times and lives into the struggle to emancipate the lives of the African masses, blacks and women in particular from the unjust terrors of capitalism such as racial, gender and class oppression. What is paramount is for members of the ANC to adhere to the constitution as a guide to discipline and focus on its historic program and those members will be good leaders. Sent from my iPhone On 19 Jan 2012, at 3:31 PM, morgan phaahla <[email protected]> wrote: Cde Gugu, let's me first establish basis for arguing that the ANC is patently infected to the point of no return. You'll recall that in my previous posting I did mention that the rot lies at the top. Those entrusted to uphold organisational principles, aims and objectives as set out in the Constitution have distinguished themselves to be unreliable, ill-disciplined both in their private capacity and in public to the extent that their conduct and decision-making abilities have caused a great degree of divisions in the ANC. The cracks in Limpopo are a mirror image of the NEC and the health of the ANC in totality, with exceptions of some regions. Cde David Makhura in his capacity as ANC Gauteng provincial secretary said "The ANC is a patient and it is sick, it needs intervention." Everyone can deduce from this statement that there is a crisis from within. I also pointed out that the ANCYL saga, which appears to be central to all of this, was not properly handled by the leadership and cde Phosa is provoking the NEC to take similar steps against him knowing very well that the ANCYL and those disgruntled in their respective circumstances will use this opportunity to back him up. It would lead to what is dubbed organisational paralysis in 100 years of its existence. What I foresee is the upcoming conference turned into a mayhem, thus reduced to debate technicalities and NEC decisions on discipline meted out to certain individuals, who are very vocal and popular. This will create a fertile ground for rogue elements to hijack a platform to cause disharmony - a state of being susceptible to factional interests. What remains a challenge ahead of the conference is for the branches to redefine a cadre and a leader in the ANC, and so is their impact on the ANC political culture and society at large. It's only the branches that can redefine the multi-class character of the ANC within the changing context of society. In a nutshell, cde Gugu, change from the top is the only wayforward. And Mangaung presents a solid ground for the branches to change the course of history for the betterment of the society. ANC is in dire need of a new calibre of cadres and leaders. Remain, Morgan Phaahla "Sometimes, if you wear suits for too long, it changes your ideology." - Joe Slovo --- On Thu, 1/19/12, Gugu Ndima <[email protected]> wrote: From: Gugu Ndima <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [YCLSA Discussion] ANC National Officials: Issue of the Treasurer General of the ANC and other matters To: [email protected] Date: Thursday, January 19, 2012, 2:49 AM So Morgan in your view, where to from here? On Wed, Jan 18, 2012 at 4:45 PM, morgan phaahla <[email protected]> wrote: The ANC is patently infected to the point of no return. What is to be done? The only way forward is to change the course of history and leadership will follow as a direct consequence. Amandla! "Sometimes, if you wear suits for too long, it changes your ideology." - Joe Slovo --- On Tue, 1/17/12, Domza VC <[email protected]> wrote: From: Domza VC <[email protected]> Subject: [YCLSA Discussion] ANC National Officials: Issue of the Treasurer General of the ANC and other matters To: [email protected] Date: Tuesday, January 17, 2012, 10:43 AM <ANC> ANC Media Release, 17 January 2012 Statement of the ANC National Officials The National Officials of the African National Congress have met on the 16th January 2012, and amongst other things discussed, was the issue of the Treasurer General of the ANC on the comments he made during the centenary celebrations in Limpopo. This came up as a result of stories that were carried by the media pertaining to the issue of disciplinary action and as well as the issue placing some departments in Limpopo under administration by national government. As the Officials we agreed on the need to uphold the responsibility of investing in the unity of this organization. We further agreed that this will be achieved with the leadership of the ANC not sending different messages to the public. This, we view as not suppression of views but a leadership responsibility of communicating consistent messages at all times. On the issue of the disciplinary case, we have agreed that it is correct for leadership to stay clear off the process as the Officials will be expected to implement the outcome of the process. If any of the National Officials comment on a matter that is still pending it may be interpreted as trying to influence the outcome. It is therefore not correct for any of the Officials to comment on the content and outcome of any case. The meeting also reflected on the comments made on the issue of placing some departments under national administration in the Limpopo, Free State and Gauteng Provinces. The Officials re-affirmed the position of the ANC as the strategic centre of power, and that it deploys people and strategies to ensure the improved administration in government. Our role as officials may be to ask for reports and not condemn a correct decision that seeks to improve public administration. The decision taken by the National government of placing these departments under administration is an intervention that is meant to tighten government administration and this decision is supported by the findings of the Auditor General. As the ANC we are responsible to reinforce good governance and accountable administration. As the officials we need to stick to policies of the organization. Loyalty to decision that have been taken by the ANC based on organizational or governance prescripts will minimize the multiplicity of messages. Issued by: Gwede Mantashe ANC Secretary General African National Congress Chief Albert Luthuli House 54 Sauer street Johannesburg 17 January 2012 Enquiries: Jackson Mthembu 082 370 8401 Keith Khoza 082 823 9672 -- You are subscribed. This footer can help you. Please POST your comments to [email protected] or reply to this message. You can visit the group WEB SITE at http://groups.google.com/group/yclsa-eom-forum for different delivery options, pages, files and membership. To UNSUBSCRIBE, please email [email protected] . You don't have to put anything in the "Subject:" field. You don't have to put anything in the message part. All you have to do is to send an e-mail to this address (repeat): [email protected] . -- You are subscribed. This footer can help you. Please POST your comments to [email protected] or reply to this message. You can visit the group WEB SITE at http://groups.google.com/group/yclsa-eom-forum for different delivery options, pages, files and membership. To UNSUBSCRIBE, please email [email protected] . You don't have to put anything in the "Subject:" field. You don't have to put anything in the message part. All you have to do is to send an e-mail to this address (repeat): [email protected] . -- Gugu Ndima +27 76 783 1516 -- You are subscribed. This footer can help you. Please POST your comments to [email protected] or reply to this message. You can visit the group WEB SITE at http://groups.google.com/group/yclsa-eom-forum for different delivery options, pages, files and membership. To UNSUBSCRIBE, please email [email protected] . You don't have to put anything in the "Subject:" field. You don't have to put anything in the message part. All you have to do is to send an e-mail to this address (repeat): [email protected] . -- You are subscribed. This footer can help you. Please POST your comments to [email protected] or reply to this message. 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Please POST your comments to [email protected] or reply to this message. You can visit the group WEB SITE at http://groups.google.com/group/yclsa-eom-forum for different delivery options, pages, files and membership. To UNSUBSCRIBE, please email [email protected] . You don't have to put anything in the "Subject:" field. You don't have to put anything in the message part. All you have to do is to send an e-mail to this address (repeat): [email protected] .
