Hi Bill, > So...zen teachers usually (and properly) just tell a student that zazen has > no goal. What they don't say I guess is that if you are practicing zen with a > goal in mind, you'll eventually have to deal with that also.
I don't think anyone can practise without goal (no matter how the teacher says not to, or even how one believes that he/she is not supposed to have any goal) until he deals with this. Until then, either one practises with goal, or thinks he practises without goal. Siska -----Original Message----- From: "Bill!" <[email protected]> Sender: [email protected] Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2011 00:58:20 To: <[email protected]> Reply-To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [Zen] Zen, zen and Theravada Buddhism ED, You are persistent! Do you have a profession in sales? The reason you'll see a lot of zen teachings which say that zen or zazen has "no hope, expectation, reason or gain" - no goal, is that it anything like that would be an attachment. Attachments cause suffering. That's Buddhism 101. So...zen teacher's don't want you to just add on another attachment. I can only answer for myself. When I began zen practice I certainly had a goal. It was a very selfish goal. That goal (attachment) certianly got me started and helped me persist in my early practice. BUT at sometime I had to abandon that goal for at least 2 reasons: 1 - is that it was a goal that if achieved would be harmful to me, and 2 - is was just another attachment that I had to 'see through' and discard. Actually in writing these I just found out they say the same thing. The goal turned out to be just another illusion. So...zen teachers usually (and properly) just tell a student that zazen has no goal. What they don't say I guess is that if you are practicing zen with a goal in mind, you'll eventually have to deal with that also. ...Bill! --- In [email protected], "ED" <seacrofter001@...> wrote: > > > > Bill!, > > No goal for any specific zazen session. OK. Any hope, expectation, > reason or gain for being involved in zazen, in general? Any hope, > expectation, reason or gain for being involved with Zen? > > Thanks, ED > > > > --- In [email protected], "Bill!" <BillSmart@> wrote: > > > > ED, > > > > Please read (again) Warner-Schwarner's comments below, especially this > one: > > > > [Warner-Schwarner] The goal (or even "a goal") of zazen is not to > clear your mind of thoughts. There is no goal of zazen. > > > > ...Bill! >
