Bill, How about 'Tough Love one another'...?
--- In [email protected], William Rintala <brintala@...> wrote: > > Just an observation here. It is so hard to determine what is meant by what > is > written in emails. I percieve stress in this last exchange, frustration, > almost > anger but then what was meant might be simply gentle prodding or poking. > > > Years ago I was involved in an email exchange regarding an issue at the > hospital > where I worked. I responded to a query by asking "What is it about this > issue > that concerns you?" It was reported to my supervisor and I was asked to make > a > face to face apology. When I realized that what I was asking could be > taken > negatively I was horrified and I've never trusted email since. > > > I don't know where it fits in Zen but "Love one another" needs to be there > somewhere. Otherwise you end up punching yourself in the face. >  Bill not Bill! > > > > > Find what makes your heart singâ¦and do it! > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Kristopher Grey <kris@...> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Tue, September 4, 2012 1:12:29 AM > Subject: Re: [Zen] Re: " dancing with the daffodils" > >  > On 9/3/2012 6:46 PM, mike brown wrote: > > I think you have a very shallow idea about what vipassana is. > > Doesn't matter a wit if I do or don't - but since you keep dragging your > cushion around for me to see: FWIW I don't think it's zoning out at all > (though some will use it that way). It's also not like you invented it, > or it's a big secret. Do you get a discount, or good karma, for > mentioning it? ;) > > No matter what I express, you come back to you own assumptions about > what I think - mostly involving some perceived attack on your practice. > This makes one of us appears shallow, and the other appear simple > minded. You can choose which is which. > > Any practice can be an escape - or retreat if you prefer. Why do you > think people organize/attend those? Some find it helpful to disengage in > that way. Creating greater contrast between self-awareness and > autopilot, until that sort of in/out of awareness structure implodes. > The house of cards you mentioned. Then 'practice' opens up. > > My concern is with the user, not the practices used. With what they > think they are fixing, or what fix they are getting from it. A not so > subtle difference. > > There is a similar difference to how you and I are using the term > 'mindfulness'. What you describe I might call a basic sense of > self-awareness. A sort of 'witnessing' with/as a conscience. This can be > developed, as it is still 'ordinary mind' (clearly not all have the same > capacities in this regard, and it appears to come and go, etc.). If > something you "do" then it's a form of mindfulness training, which is > still ordinary mind training (while such a distinction makes sense > anyway) and will serve as long as you still have ordinary uses for it > (meaning you are still alive/functioning). Catching and getting control > of the "ox". The higher and lower self business of other traditions. The > conflicted animal and godlike natures of man. Fortunately, even this > division can be seen as false. Short of that, much personal struggle > appears. All is seen through that lens. > > Anyway, my point was not - despite your well intentioned but unnecessary > defenses/efforts to skew them as such - a criticism of your practice. I > was simply noting the way you appear to differentiate practice from > other experiences, maybe attaching some significance in the process that > reinforces this. How this is can be 'counterproductive', yet is also an > integral aspect of any practice, an aspect of what the practice reveals, > what is carried to all other experiences... what has always simply been > this experiencing... > > Tomorrow, remind me to stick to one liners and crappy neo-haiku. Still > reeks of rotting flesh, but less dead bones for zen dogs to sniff > at/snarl over. > > KG > > PS - Equanimity is not a a lack of personality, or invariability of > reactions to what arises. No stone Buddha! "Cranky" was simply my > acknowledgement of what was presenting. Redirected energies, responding > differently to different stimuli/situations. I see no need wasting more > energy pretending to be this or that, unless I do. Something I used to > do to manipulate myself and others, I now only do if it aids > interactions with others. Looks the same. > ------------------------------------ Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: [email protected] [email protected] <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [email protected] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
