Greetings Suresh!
Insights are not gifts given by others, but innate realizations. Inward
sights. Realizations, rather than learned facts.
If they appear otherwise, or seem triggered by others, then they are
either just adopted concepts or[the insight is that] there is more to
realize about the nature of the inner and outer appearances, the
interplay [or 'Lila' if you prefer] of reality.
If I may quote myself from past dialogs (hopefully full 'contradictions):
"Any insights you have (and any wisdom you find) are just that,
IN-sights. Revealing what is always present."
"Teachings may seem to offer great insights (ways to help you see for
yourself), but Wisdom is lost in attempts to know."
"Coincidences, contradiction, and conundrums are concurrent insights.
Mind intersecting mind." [what finer pointer can present?]
"Your reactions to the words are the 'pointers', not the words
themselves. Insights are not received from them, but reflections of them."
Ramana said different things to different people. The reason for this is
clear enough. When reading accounts of him speaking to others you will
either see this [and how it points them back to look at themselves], or
you will see contradictions in his 'teaching' and fail to recognize the
pointer.
Either way, he is not speaking to you now, except as you re-imagine his
words and meanings. Therein lies the source of all such apparent
contradictions.
A guru may offer many many shortcuts, none of them yours to take.
As Ramana toold U.G. - "I can give it, but can you take it?"
"Let me put my understanding on my own questions?" you asked.
Yes. It can only appear you are doing otherwise. There is no right or
wrong way of it, no long or short of it, but only you may realize this.
Look at why/where/how such questions arise.
Catch the tiger by its tail.
Watch the lightning, feel the thunder.
Smell the flowers.
Tat tvam asi, as they say.
KG
PS - You ended with: "So my conclusion is it is the perception of a
person depends on his capability (deep inner meditation)."
Perception is a capability, so this seems to me a rather circular
argument - or a 'contradiction' juxtaposing inter-dependent faculties.
"Oh what a tangled web we weave... "
Today's shortcut: Mindfulness, is never what you think it is! ;)
On 8/2/2013 7:24 AM, SURESH JAGADEESAN wrote:
> Dear KG,
>
> Let me put my understanding on my own questions?
>
> Realized gurus answers are based on receivers as you so mentioned
> about different type of Metallurgy, and hence their answers will
> contradict if we look at it as if it is addressed to all as common.
> But it would have given great meaning and insight to the receivers who
> have asked the question those time.
>
> World will be unreal for god, the self, the whole, but not for
> individual souls/jivas. Until one is realized as self (become god) the
> world will be real, once realized it is just a maya, a play.
>
> So Ramana statement is true as far as his godhood(self) state is concerned.
>
> The self, the non-dual Brahman is the real god, who preserve the body
> of individual soul during his sleep allowing the karma to prevail at
> all times.
>
> Isvara may be the siva form for that disciple and hence he answered
> those forms of lord also vanish on dissolution, only non-dual Brahman
> will remain.
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Quote
> This is not science class. Ramana is not teaching you things to know.
> You must go into this and see this directly. It has nothing to do with
> what you think, or don't think about it.
>
> Contradiction is a matter of limited opinions, of positions. Stop
> preposing the preposterous and simply (or not) look.
> Unquote
>
>
> If you have ever Read Collected works of Ramana fully and thoroughly,
> you might have come across these words, i.e. Ramana himself states
> "science of self" in one place. All religious philosophies are pure
> science only. Science and Philosophies are same, only difference is
> science deals with outer things, and philosophies deals with inner,
> the inner most energy behind the visible universe.
>
> So it is certainly science class only. Are you a realized soul? then
> don't preach or give hypocritical statement i.e. to say personally not
> felt or experienced just pass information read from some book to show
> of your wisdom you think you possess.
>
>
>
> Many don’t like me questioning on anyone or anything, I don’t know
> why? I learn by
> questioning only. To question does not mean I degrade somebody.
>
> I kept thinking about my questions again and again and that above
> answer I got today morning when I was coming to office. But I waited
> to see different answers.
>
> So my conclusion is it is the perception of a person depends on his
> capability (deep inner meditation).
>
> I hope I answered and which may not hurt anyone.
>
> Let Ramana bless us all.
>
> Best wishes
> Suresh
>
>
------------------------------------
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