--- In [email protected], John Davis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > Message: 11 > > Date: Mon, 02 Jan 2006 20:58:08 -0000 > > From: "dkotschessa" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Subject: Re: Zen & Buddhism > > > > --- In [email protected], "Edward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > What do you think about practicing zazen without being or becoming a > > > Buddhist? Are they inextricably intertwined or can they be separate? > > > Can one achieve the full benefits of zazen without being buddhist? > > > > > > > Of course it is fine to practice zazen without being identified as a > > Buddhist. As far as the "full benefits," though, I will speak a > > little more. > > > > I think there comes a certain point in meditation practice where you > > find that the 30 minutes or one hour a day isn't enough in itself. > > This is not to say that you have to practice sitting for more hours, > > but that you have to make zazen a part of your complete experience, 24 > > hours a day. > > > > This involves being mindful in all your activity. You still don't > > have to "be a buddhist" at this point. But having some structure in > > your practice is helpful, and I think becoming associated with a > > sangha (community of practitioners) is very helpful in this regard. > > > > There is also the case where sila, or morality comes into play, > > because if you are "acting unskillfully" in your every day life it > > will create problems for you in your zazen. Most of the thoughts that > > we are dealing with in zazen are a result of our actions. So > > practicing Right Speech, Action, and Livelihood in a consciencious way > > is another extention of zazen. > > > > Can you do all this and still not be a Buddhist? I don't see why > > not. I don't even know whether I'm a Buddhist or not. I haven't > > officially taken the precepts. But I try to incorporate the entire > > eightfold path into my life. > > > Now here is the meat of the matter...Or rather, the bone...Zen is what you do when you > sit Zazen...What you believe is something else. The two are not mutually exclusive. > There is, for example another Yahoo group I belong to called Zenchristians. > I too have not taken the precepts or even attended a formal Zendo for many years. I > practice on my own, as part of my Martial Arts training. However, I have given up on > church life too, there is too much hypocracy in churches for me. > > Now having said that, many people find joining a sangha and practicing the other stuff > like sutra chanting and rituals and meal gathas and such helpful in their practice. > But, even some of the great Zenji or Masters of the past (what's the word? Ancestors or > predecessors) have said that all that is window dressing and it is the sitting that > leads to enlightenmet. Ever hear someone say "if you meet the Buddha on the path to > enlightenment (or alternatively, the road), kill him?" What this means is sometimes > even the Buddha himself can be an impediment to enlightenment if he becomes an > attachment. Me, I just let go and sit. But then, that's just me. :) > > As a beginner, finding someone to aid you in your practice is good. We can do what we > can here, but I don't think we have any abbots or roshi on this list.(?) I know Kwanum > School of Zen (which has a group, not too active since Seung Sahn's paranirvana) has > put people in touch with their leaders who have internet access. They can also find a > zendo close to you. But still it comes down to who sits and who counts the breaths. > > What I believe in personally, would take a book to explain. > > Gassho, > John > > > Ki is extending, > John Davis > > "Let us have a Universal Mind > that loves and protects all creation > and helps all things grow and develop. > To unify mind and body and become One with the Universe > is the ultimate purpose of our study." > -- Koichi Tohei Sensei > > "Masakatsu - Righteous victory, proper attitude > Agatsu - Victory over self > Katsuhayahi - Victory over speed of light, doing things so perfectly that time is no longer a factor" > -- Akira Tohei Sensei, no relation to the above. This from an interview in www.aikidoonline.com/ . > > "Beware the Medical-Industrial Complex!" > -- John Davis >
It depends on how serious a matter you take practice. 30 minutes of sitting a day is not enough, not even close. Nor is an hour or two. You must be "doing zen" 24/7. How you do it is up to you. When you have distractions that take you away from being mindful, the practice is a lot more challenging, but not impossible. So residency in a community is just a way of concentrating practice. For me, occasional visits and retreats are heplful to get me back in sync. Being a resident of such a place isn't really practical for most of us. Ultimately it doesn't matter what you do, as long as you do it mindfully, with your whole mind and body. It can even be Christianity or Judaism. Just done with the whole mind and body. That's all. ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/S27xlB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Current Book Discussion: Appreciate Your Life by Taizan Maezumi Roshi Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ZenForum/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
