Hi Brendan,

Thanks a lot for raising this issue. And yes, help with improving it is
very welcome!

With respect to the practicalities: I'm administrating both the website and
the launchpad project pages. I would propose some kind of collaboration to
draft a new webpage, and when it is ready to go live, I'll just push it to
the server.

At the moment the website is part of the code archive together with a
script in "tools/" to run it as a local server for testing. So changing the
website can be justs a new branch on launchpad. But I'm also open to other
tools / sites for collaboration.


Couple of resources that could be used:

* https://www.openhub.net/p/zim -- visualize the project activity stats --
especially a ticker like the "stats" widget (
https://www.openhub.net/p/zim/widgets) could help

* http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~jaap.karssenberg/zim/pyzim/files  -- this
give more of a "live" code view

* https://lists.launchpad.net/zim-wiki/  -- mailing list archive, you are
right, the search function went AWOL :(  seems launchpad has it's best days
behind it .... workaround might be to use google with the query "site:
https://lists.launchpad.net/zim-wiki";

* https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=zim+desktop+wiki  -- results
in quite a few screencasts about zim, including those made by regulars on
this list :)


Apart from the things you raise I have also still in my mind to
re-structure the website based on your "getting work done in zim"
presentation and my own slide desk. Changing it to a format that "sucks you
in" by showing how to use it. Ideal case I would want the same structure
for both manual and the website, but I realize the website needs some
additional info people look for that does not belong in a manual.

Anyway, let's fix the easy stuff first before doing a full re-structuring.

Regards,

Jaap




On Mon, Mar 14, 2016 at 6:54 PM, <sn...@glump.net> wrote:

> In the Zim chat room I had two people wander in independent of each other
> and ask if the project was dead, in the past 12 hours.
>
> There are some problems with Zim's web presence:
>
>    - How do you find release dates, starting from http://zim-wiki.org/
>    <http://zim-wiki.org/index.html> ?
>    - You have to click on Contribute, then the first link on that page
>       gets to the Launchpad project. Then you click Code, then lp:zim, then
>       Browse the Code, then CHANGELOG.txt.
>       - If you don't think to look at Contribute, or you're not a
>       habitual Launchpad user, you will probably fail to find the changelog 
> this
>       way.
>       - If you open the project URL from Contribute, then go to the Code
>       tab, and then actually read the paragraph at the top of
>       https://code.launchpad.net/zim , then Zim REALLY looks dead:
>       http://zim-wiki.org/bzr/pyzim/ . If you don't know Bazaar, you'd
>       assume this shared folder is empty and the ".bzr" subfolder is just 
> junk.
>       - The Downloads page has dead links to "Source" and "Packages".
>    Actually no they're headings, but they look like links that got 
> unlinkified.
>    - Zim is a desktop wiki. What is this "Wiki" page? The information
>    scent <
>    https://www.nngroup.com/articles/wrong-information-scent-costs-sales/ >
>    of that top-level navigation link is nil. People aren't clicking it.
>
>
> Recommendations:
>
>    - Immediately create a "History" or "Change log" top-level page on
>    http://zim-wiki.org/ that is a placeholder directing the user to view
>    
> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~jaap.karssenberg/zim/pyzim/view/head:/CHANGELOG.txt
>  (or
>    transcludes it directly into the page on the main web site).
>    - Maybe make a comment about the release cadence of the project on the
>    Downloads page.
>    - Fix this paragraph on the Launchpad project's Code page: "Zim hosts
>    its code at http://www.zim-wiki.org/bzr/pyzim."; It needs to say
>    something about the fact that this is a Bazaar repo, not the kind of live
>    web view you'd expect from GitHub or BitBucket.
>    - Rename the "Wiki" navigation link on the main web site to
>    "User-Contributed Documentation" or "Community Documentation".
>    - Add a top-level page for "Mailing List" that points to the mailing
>    list home page AND to directly to the mailing list search form. (Wait ...
>    CAN you search the mailing list archive? I can't find it.)
>    - A chat room user wanted a screencast that demonstrates critical
>    features of Zim. Something like that must be in the mailing list archive
>    somewhere. It should be saved in a safe location and promoted on
>    http://zim-wiki.org/
>
>
> Who is in charge of the main web site and the Launchpad pages? Is there
> anything I can do to help with these communication issues that are driving
> users away?
>
> And I hope no one is offended by this post. I'm trying to be helpful and
> point out that we are probably losing prospective users due to a few design
> issues in our public web presence.
>
> Brendan Kidwell
>
>
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