On Dec 2, 2009, at 5:39 AM, Jim Fulton wrote:

> On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 7:19 AM, Martin Aspeli <optilude+li...@gmail.com> 
> wrote:
>> Jim Fulton wrote:
>>> In any case, nothing is deleted in subversion. If someone creates even
>>> minimal tests that exercise the code you changed, then I'll
>>> be happy to reapply the change. At some point, if no one takes
>>> responsibility for repozo, I'm inclined to remove it from the
>>> distribution, as there is an implied promise of support,
>>> which seems to be lacking.
>> I think all hope of anyone taking the ZODB seriously outside those
>> already wedded to it would be lost if there wasn't some kind of
>> supported backup solution.
> Have I ever said a supported backup solution wasn't important?
> BTW, offline back ups if file-storage even with Blobs is
> straightforward without repozo.

No, it's not. What do we use to check for integrity of the other backups? 
fsrefs? fstest? fsoids? Many of the ZODB Scripts are barely useful and 
certainly not 'straightforward'.

Tangent: 'straightforward' is the new 'simply'. Just because one is close to 
the tools and has been using them for many years does not mean that everyone 
else has them. The ZODB tool chain is not discoverable.

And I think it's funny that you give so much concern to Blobs when I have 
abandoned them in sheer frustration. And I recognize your concerns about 
angering / frustrating / losing users because a tool does not seem to work, 
because that's how I feel about Blobs.

>> The correct course of action here, in my opinonion, is not to make
>> threats, but to try to encourage people to step up. I find that a
>> positive message works much better for encouragement than a negative one.
> I haven't made any threats. It is dishonest to include a backup
> tool in ZODB that isn't supported. Users would have expectations
> that aren't met.

I don't think that any of the ZODB scripts are in good shape. There's nothing I 
can confidently give to a system administrator. There's an old Wiki page of 
documentation for a handful of the tools, and that's about it. At least 
'repozo' has good and useful information to spit out when you use the '-h' / 
'—help' switch.

I'm not sure whose expectations you're satisfying as the items in ZODB.scripts 
are a wild and inconsistent mess. It's been trial and error just to find ones 
that seem to work, outside of repozo.

Jeff Shell

For more information about ZODB, see the ZODB Wiki:

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