>When an illiterate person
>is given Crocin (and perhaps for the first time in his
>life) to
reduce temperature and then told Jesus Christ
>healed him, that is as simple as fraud.
Frankly speaking I don't see what
is the problem in above.
In all religions we more or less do
exactly this which may be called fraud.
We take medicine and go to temple
to pray to save us, and when saved, we say it is only God who saved
us.
We study and go to exam and pray to
Goddess Swaraswati to pass in exam, and credit her for our success.
We do bsuiness and credit our
success to Sai Baba,
We have small pox and pray ti 'Ai'
and credit her for the cure.
Exactly in the same line, the
Christian missionary is saying that yes, you need to take 'crocine' but
ultimately it is Jesus Christ who will have to bless you to cure like any Hindu
God or Goddess for cure. We do
this 'crocin' frauds in all religions. Why we are trying to single out the
Christians as indulging in fraud and leave the Brahmin priest who is making the
Indian give 'pindo' to his dead ancestor? All are frauds to the same
degree.
RB
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2006 8:02
AM
Subject: [Assam] Analgesics to the
Rescue
At 8:04 PM -0700 5/24/06, Rajib Das wrote:
I defined it earlier. See the crocin
story.
>When an illiterate person
>is given Crocin (and perhaps for the first time in his
>life)
to reduce temperature and then told Jesus Christ
>healed him, that is as simple as fraud.
** Yeah I saw that. Crocin, an analgesic, to the rescue? That is
laughable. It does however point to the reasoning abilities of certain people,
who could and would willingly make the argument that it might be enough for an
'illiterate' person to 'convert'. I would submit, that the 'literacy' or
'education' of those proffering such arguments is something that requires
serious evaluation. Read on, and you will see why.
But let us accept even that as an example of fraudulent inducements to
drive them 'illiterates' to convert to Christianity from whatever their faith
might be. If it is Hinduism, then it would not speak much of their Hindu
faith--considering that it melts in the heat of Christian analgesics like the
wicked witches of fairy-tales.
Now then, could 'crocin' induced conversions be reversed with stronger
Hindu medicine? What if the Hinduttwa brigades came to the battle with
powerful weaponry like education, social-work, and the really big
guns--antibiotics? Could that win over Christian 'crocin'?
If NOT, why so?
Umesh will argue that Hindus have no money! But that argument we
can safely discard. I am sure I would not need to hurt anyone's feelings by
going into a painful explanation of why.
So, why is it irreversible? Why is a 'coerced', 'fraudulent',
'bribery' induced conversion irreversible? What prevents the misled from being
shown the light and brought back into the right fold?
The only answers I can see are:
A: These 'illiterates' are forever incorrigible.
But this does
not stand to reason.
B: Once they touch Christianity, they never could come back to Hinduism,
or whatever faith they belonged to prior to the 'fraudulent' conversion.
This might have
some basis, on the 'jaat mora' concept widely
prevalent among
vast numbers of Hindus.
But I know why
no Hindu above the level of an imbecile would
touch that
explanation.
C: That this whole 'coerced' or 'fraudulent' or 'forced' conversion
argument is bogus as a three rupee note!
--- Chan Mahanta
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Define
fraudulent.
>
> But the big question that no Hindu will or
can
> answer is HOW can a
> forced, or fraudulent or coerced
conversion stick,
> unless the 'jaat
> mora' factor, an
essentially caste based Hindu
> shame, is operative?
> What
prevents the converted from reverting to her
> original state,
>
once he is explained that she was converted by
> fraudulent means,
or
> deceived, or
coerced?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
At 7:25 PM -0700 5/24/06, Rajib Das wrote:
> >What about fraudulent
conversion?
> >
> >--- Rajib Das
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> >>
Mikeda,
> >>
> >> Another gem from the Oracle
of Oxom :-)
> >>
> >> Rajib
>
>>
> >> --- mc mahant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>
---------------------------------
> >>
> >>
Rajen Barua's lucid explanation of what never
> >>
happened-nor will- forced conversion.
> >>
>
>> BJP OUGHT TO BE ASKED:
> >>
>
>> "Shrimanji Hindimey Boliye"
> >>
>
>> mm
> >>
> >>
> >>
>
>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
>
>> ---------------------------------
> >>
>
>> From: umesh sharma
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >> Reply-To:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >> To: Rajen Barua
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Ram
> >> Sarangapani
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,AssamNet
> >>
<assam@assamnet.org>
> >> Subject: Re: [Assam]
India protests over Pope
> >> comments -BBC
>
>> Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 19:56:50 +0100 (BST)
>
>>
> >>
> >> Rajen-da wrote:
>
>>
> >> *** And in my
opinion telling people that
> there is
> >> God is
the biggest fraud of religion.
> >>
>
>> I think you made your point amply clear.
>
>>
> >> Umesh
>
>>
> >>
> >> Rajen Barua
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> >. Let us know how you
feel about a
> Theocratic
> >> leader - the Pope -
trying to teach India about
> >> secularism
>
>>
> >> I think in this
case, we are giving him the
> scope
> >> to
>
>> teach, and that is why he is trying to teach.
> Why
we
> >> need to give that scope.
>
>> Religious conversion should be a freedom
for
> >> anybody - aspirin or not- period.
>
>> India is violating this fundamental human
>
right.
> >>
> >> Tell
me this.
> >> Why we allow political
conversion - by
> bribing,
> >> cheating and false
promises, and not religious
> >> freedom?.
>
>> If religion is a way of social life,
political
> >> parties are also ways of our political
life.
> >> Why we allow free political
conversion and not
> >> religious conversion?
>
>> What exactly is the difference between
>
religion
> >> and
> >> politics.
>
>> Don't tell me that religion involve with
God.
> >> Is Hinduism is not fraud when we
tell people
> that
> >> God created four
castes?
> >> Is that true?
>
>> What God has to do it?
>
>> And in my opinion telling people that there
is
> God
> >> is the biggest fraud of
religion.
> >>
> >>
>
>> >Do you think India or any country for
that
> matter
> >> should send its ambassadors to a
nation
> (Vatican)
> >> whose sole purpose is to
promote their faith -
> and
> >> stop other
>faiths from flourishing?
> >>
>
>> This is another fraud India is doing. Why
in
> the
> >> hell India is sending an ambassador to
Vatican
> at
> >> all?
> >> Who is
telling India to send an ambassador at
> all?
>
>> India should
> >> have the guts
not to send any ambassador to
> Vatican.
> >> Why
India not sending an ambassador to Dalai
> Lama's
>
>> monastaery?
> >> But that does
not take the responsibility away
> >> from
>
>> India to give freedom for free religious
>
conversion
> >> like political conversion. If we
allow fraud in
> >> politics, we better allow fraud in
religion.
> >> RB
>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>
>> From: umesh sharma
>
>> To: Barua25 ; Ram Sarangapani ; AssamNet
>
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 12:35 PM
>
>> Subject: Re: [Assam] India protests over
Pope
> >> comments -BBC
> >>
>
>>
> >> Rajen-da,
>
>>
> >> You always try to
make politically correct
> >> statements. Let us know how
you feel about a
> >> Theocratic leader - the Pope -
trying to teach
> India
> >> about
secularism.
> >>
> >>
Don't give us that we should take advice from
> >>
anyone
> >> and everyone -as long it is good.Do you
think
> India
> >> or
> >> any
country for that matter should send its
> >> ambassadors
to a nation (Vatican) whose sole
> purpose
> >> is
to promote their faith - and stop other
> faiths
>
>> from
> >> flourishing?
> >
>
> >> Umesh
>
>>
> >> Barua25 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
>> wrote:
> >>
>
>> >The BJP says that it
supports legislation
> to
> >> ban "forced religious
conversions", because many
> >> Christian >missionaries
recruit converts among
> the
> >> majority Hindu
population using financial and
> >> educational
enticements.
> >> I fail to understand what is
called a "forced
> >> religious conversion" specially by
the
> Christians.
> >> People can be persuaded,
people can be bribed,
> but
> >> people can be
forced to convert? What is wrong
> in
> >>
Christians giving financial and educational
> >>
enticements? Why the Hindus cannot counter with
> >>
better
> >> educational enticement? We discussed
this
> before. I
>
=== message truncated
===
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