-Caveat Lector-
In a message dated 99-01-10 01:07:10 EST, you write:
<< The gentleman claimed that Warren Harding was a great man. Since he made
the claim I was only asking why he believed it to be true. Not an
unreasonable request.
Since you're posting on Harding...please be forthcoming. What information
can you shed on the subject? None, I guess. Then, you shift over to the
subject of President Clinton..>>
I have no interest in Harding... long dead, long forgotten. It was you
Clintonites who keep shifting from Clinton to the evil Republicans, never
answering any of my posts with substance or even common sense. You support
this criminal in the White House even though he has done nothing worth
supporting. This is only a Clintonite tactic... this shifting of the
subject... something the Clintonites know well... a subtle form of mind
control and like the President... avoiding the issue.
<<First off, he is not my hero. He wasn't my first choice. I wanted someone
who would address the collapse of American manufacturing and stop our
slide into globalism. Clinton is really a product of the DNC, a group
that has a strong corporate/globalist orientation interested in pushing
through NAFTA and GATT, two trade measures I opposed. So, I'm not
happy with him.>>
The way you defend Clinton, you leave the impression that you respect/like him
as President in many of your former posts. Democrats/Republicans are the
same, they both voted for NAFTA and GATT. Both parties receive money (bribes)
from big business (the rich) and pass legislation. Clinton is also pushing
for "fast-track" authority on MAI... that issue isn't dead yet.
<< I'm an economic nationalist. Since you seem to be free with the term,
"traitor," I think it is just short of treasonous for American
corporations to continue using slave labor around the world, close down
plants in America, open up operations in hellholes around the world, then
bring their shoddy, slave-labor products back into the US to sell them at
inflated prices. That is irresponsible and in my book, because
they are undercutting the economic well-being of working families here in
the United States. This policy of globalization has been pushed by both
political parties (Republicans champion it as well as Democrats). Clinton
is just continuing the policies of his predecessors (going back to
Nixon--a Republican president--who championed an open door policy to
China.)
Of course, I believe that we need to develop peaceful trading policies
with other countries..but not at the expense of our own people.
On this point, we have serious philosophical differences. I believe that
everyone--both labor and the business sector must pursue policies that
further the common good--by that I mean, they should pursue economic
policies that further the best interests of their own country. We could
learn from the Japanese on this point. The Japanese business class does
not impoverish their own workers in order to make a quick buck like we will
do. They are profoundly patriotic. They're not interested in undercutting
the economic
well-being of their own people. Nor do they craft trade policies
that are in the worst interests of their own fellow citizens. As a
result, they don't have the kind of rancorous class divisions we have
here...
Of course, the analogy falls apart when you consider that they are a
homogeneous society...without the racial/ethnic/religious/ divisions..
but their professional elites (the most privileged members of their
system) do not seek to impoverish their own citizens.
Examples: Nike, Boeing, General Electric, General Motors,...a long list of
manufacturers, food producers, etc.
From my own personal experience in my former community of Mayfield,
Kentucky...three manufacturing
industries were closed up and moved overseas (Dillon Manufacturing,
Mary-Nell and a boot company whose name I've forgotten).>>
I agree with all you have said about American corporations, that is, the large
corporations, most of which are multinational. Corporations run the
government, they vote with their money to get special acts to benefit
themselves. Perhaps the real criminals are the CEOs, presidents and board of
directors who sit on many different companies and use the stockholders money
to advance their own private bank accounts by stock buybacks, political
contributions, contributions to colleges, trusts, and other tax free
"benevolent" organisations.
The Japanese do have the advantage of being almost one race. Their laws
are based more on what is right for the country rather than what is right for
the minorities. Japan does have a small minority of Chinese and Koreans
living there, but they are not given any special privileges as are minorities
in this country. I base these observations on my living in Japan from 1974 -
1978, things may have changed some since then.
<<You called President
Clinton a "traitor." Walk the walk yourself, sir.
Be specific. The sale of missile technology to the Chinese? I agree with
you. That was a disastrous policy...but those technology transfers
originated in the Bush administration, an administration that has had an
interest in promoting closer ties with China. >>
Not just that, but the sale of supercomputers to the Red Chinese and the
Russians. The practice of giving/selling encryption technology to them. In
the military we refer to communications security/information security as
COMSEC. Compromising COMSEC is grounds to be imprisoned or
terminated(executed) for treason. Clinton did this and it seems because he is
President ... he is above the law. I would be dead by now if I had done the
same thing. I hate to use the word "fair" since it has been perverted by the
socialist element in the States, but if Clinton were to be treated fairly....
wouldn't he have been imprisoned for being a draft dodger, I certainly would
have. Remember the Rosenburgs who were executed for selling secrets in the
50's, shouldn't Clinton also be executed, if he isn't then we are saying a
President is above the law. Isn't a man who puts his hand in a woman's bra or
up her skirt, and these sexual advances are unwanted... isn't that man brought
to trial, convicted and then labeled a sexual deviant?
I suppose all the drug running etc. in Mena had nothing to do with him
even though he was Govenor at the time... maybe it is the perfect cover-up...
he was busy getting blowjobs at the time.
Is it not also a conspiracy that Clinton has used the military for more
military missions than any President in history while simultaneously cutting
back on money to the military and cutting back on equipment so much that a
large country would be proud to have that much equipment in their military?
All these things together leads me to believe one thing.... Clinton is
conspiring to bring down the United States as a country. Weakening the
military so that it is less that 1947 levels. Sending military personnel
overseas, taking them out of this country where they need to be. Giving our
Communist enemies all they need to defeat us. If that isn't a conspiracy...
what is? If that isn't treason... what is?
<< So, all Clinton has been
doing is carrying out the foreign policy measures of his Republican
predecessors...>>
? More placing the blame on the evil Republicans rather than Clinton. Why, if
you do not support Clinton are you being an apologist for him?
<<Personally, I think it is a mistake to share technology with the Chinese.
But since both the Republican and Democratic administrations have approved
these sales...they were reviewed by the NSA and the State Department as
not posing a threat to the security of the United States...I don't think
it can be considered a "treasonous" act. Unless you want to argue that
President Bush was a traitor to the country as well.>>
Again... Bush is the traitor and Clinton is innocent... read what you have
written. Just more evil Republican bullshit. Bush should also be tried for
treason especially in the Iran-Contra scandals, but again... Clinton is
supposed to be the topic... more off-subject chatter.
<<Presidential accomplishments? As a Democratic President, he hasn't done
much. I would agree. In fact, he has more or less kept the nation on the
same foreign policy course that the Republican party has wanted. Both
Republicans and Democrats want a stable world order with Wall Street and
London banks at the helm. (a policy which involves giving lip service to
domestic problems here at home, while they carry out the bidding of their
corporate masters..) Since the policy of globalization continues
forward..Republicans are happy because it means an expansion of business
abroad. Labor unions are pretty much kept in check... The minority
community is pacified with token representation...and there is some
token appearance of political representation for the nation's working
people.
Maybe your particular political agenda isn't advanced (whatever that might
be), but for the most part, he has managed to keep up the illusion that
the nation isn't falling to pieces...that we can continue to run these
trade deficits without wrecking the economy...and that working people will
remain passive. So far, the formula has worked well. No real labor
unrest...the ghettos aren't exploding.. profits are up..and the most
affluent sector of the American economy is doing very very well. So that
is why this impeachment drive doesn't interest our fellow citizens. Oh
yes, and I might add that unemployment is low. Of course, people have to
work two jobs to survive..but there are jobs.>>
It's a combination of rich corporations and crooked politicians that lie to
us, take our money, make us work harder for it, then create inflation to make
our money worth less than it was when we earned it. They make profit by
putting poisons in the air, the land, the water and in our food, then charge
exorbitant prices for medical care, forcing us to work harder and longer,
shortening our lives. To keep us unaware of these actions against us the
create diversions such as football, basketball, baseball, movies, television,
and numerous other distractions to keep our mind off a government that is
slowly killing us. Some that can't be controlled are put in prison by laws we
didn't want, others are controlled by addicting them to nicotine, alcohol and
harder, more expensive drugs... expensive because they were made illegal, but
still making drugs available to the rich who can afford the high prices
Doctors charge for their vallium, antidepressants and other drugs designed for
the moneyed few. They murder us every day and we do nothing about it.
Perhaps if we start with the President, then other politicians will be
recalled and eventually honest representatives will be elected, officials that
can't be bribed or coerced by the big corporate powers. OR... we cancel the
charters of these big corporate powers and downsize the executives that have
been living off our sweat and blood for more than a hundred years, but talking
does no good at all, it requires action that most people are too lazy to
take... they would rather be given a monthly stipend, give up their freedom
(what is left of it) and let George do it. The rich get richer and the rest
of us are to support them because it is good for the economy...more bullshit.
My political agenda??? I have none, I just want to live naturally... build a
cabin in the woods, hunt, fish, and farm to sustain my life and those near and
dear to me, but the government won't let me do this. The laws telling me how
I have to live are many. Some places I can't drill a well because the water
on that land is property of the State... crap. I can't cut my own trees to
build a home for myself because some damn owl chose to make his home
there...crap. I can't build a log cabin because the property values of the
country gentry will go down unless my log cabin is valued at a quarter of a
million dollars... that would have to be one hell of a log cabin. I have to
submit my plan to build a cabin for approval to the county... why, it is my
land, then I have to pay bribe money (taxes) for the rest of my life to pay
for schools even though my children are grown, pay for libraries even though
the nearest one is a two hour drive away. I have to pay for sewers even
though it would cost me over $100,000 to tie in to it. Not to mention other
taxes to support the rich and the welfare people... screw that, let them
provide for their own care. If this is Freedom... then there must be another
name for what I want.
<< No. I am not a Clintonite. His behavior was disgusting...and he has let
down the American people. If you had read my earlier posts, you would
know that I'm not crazy about him. But I have defended him because I
don't like the idea of character assassination and smear campaigns....>>
Is it a smear campaign to assasinate the character of one who has no genuine
character, who doesn't tell the truth, who is a sexual predator, who gives
away our country to the United Nations through "Heritage River" programs and
"UN Parks" programs to promote the lives of animals over people (sustainable
developement). Does he take the reins of command and lead us into the new
century avoiding the millenium bug infesting computers... or does he plan for
martial law instead... some leader, some character.
<< I remember listening to Limbaugh one afternoon make a joke about Chelsea
Clinton....that there were two "dogs" in the White House. To attack the
President's daughter is indefensible. But that is the kind of hate
campaign that has been directed against the man and his family since his
election. If you don't like the man, vote him out. The fact that
Gingrich is gone....and Clinton's continued popularity suggests that
most Americans dislike the tactics of his political enemies more than
they dislike his personal behavior. The Republican party has made a
serious miscalculation...and if they want to win in 2000, they will have
to come up with some programs/issues that the American people can support,
or they will lose again. >>
Clinton is only popular according to polls which are bullshit. I am not a
member of any political machine... there are none worth belonging... to be a
mamber of any of them is to be a part of the problem. Only the uninformed,
uneducated or crooked admire the likes of Clinton, or any other
politician/lawyer. To me all the things mentioned above and a multitude of
items I posted last year add up to the "Clinton Conspiracy" and many on this
list are too blind to see it.
Regards,
Robert Edward Stokes II
"America is at that awkward stage; it's too late to work within the system,
but too early to shoot the bastards." I think one of the best comments on this
came from Vin Suprynowicz, who interviewed me when the book was published.
Actually, of all the things said in the interview Vin made the best comment;
he said that we have reached the time when it is morally right to "shoot the
bastards", but it is not yet practical to do so.
I do believe that a fight is inevitable, whether that's a fight in the streets
or the trenches, or whether that is some sort of confrontation that may not
involve arms but may nevertheless involve violence and head-to-head action. I
think that's inevitable, and I think more and more people are coming to the
conclusion that it is.
Claire Wolfe
19 April 1997
Libertarian Convention in Arizona
DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==========
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing! These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.
Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.
========================================================================
Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html
http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
========================================================================
To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Om
