Hi. 2019-09-16 3:02 UTC+02:00, Gary Gregory <garydgreg...@gmail.com>: > I for one appreciate Rob's efforts
We should all appreciate each others' efforts. > and would also be happy to turn the task > over to Services with our input which IMO is just our project name "Apache > Commons". This step has been taken already, and they asked about our requirements. I gave my suggestions. Gilles > > Gary > > On Sun, Sep 15, 2019 at 8:39 PM Rob Tompkins <chtom...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Pardon to cause a stir here, but that was just a mock-up that I sent to >> “Central Services” as an idea from which to work. I had no intentions of >> suggesting that we vote on it or even use is as I think that there are >> spacing and font issues with it. I thought that my email with the mock-up >> made it clear that it was a rough pass. >> >> -Rob >> >> > On Sep 15, 2019, at 7:25 PM, Gilles Sadowski <gillese...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> > >> > Le dim. 15 sept. 2019 à 23:40, sebb <seb...@gmail.com <mailto: >> seb...@gmail.com>> a écrit : >> >> >> >> Surely it would be better to use the JIRA >> >> >> >> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/COMMONSSITE-86 < >> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/COMMONSSITE-86> >> > >> > I don't get it: We agreed to let "Central Services" provide the logo >> > and now we are again presenting homegrown ones... >> > Do we really want to "bikeshed" (again) about unfinished and/or >> > unpolished products? >> > >> > The initial/original thread mentioned previously was supposed to >> > be the place were we define requirements/wishes (in words, or >> > ASCII graphics to convey the general idea). >> > I provided suggestions (in that other thread); please comment. >> > >> > Gilles >> > >> >> >> >> On Sun, 15 Sep 2019 at 21:13, Gilles Sadowski <gillese...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>> >> >>> Could we please use *one* (and the original) thread to collect ideas? >> >>> >> >>> Gilles >> >>> >> >>> Le dim. 15 sept. 2019 à 19:47, Rob Tompkins <chtom...@gmail.com> a >> écrit : >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>>> On Sep 15, 2019, at 8:10 AM, Gary Gregory <garydgreg...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>>>> >> >>>>> I do not think we need "Project", we're not a 70s progrock band ;-) >> >>>> >> >>>> I like the Alan Parsons Project, a little :-P >> >>>>> >> >>>>>> On Sun, Sep 15, 2019, 07:45 Rob Tompkins <chtom...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>>>>> Here’s a potential logo that I mocked up and sent to Kenneth. Does >> anyone have any opinions on this? I felt like something similar to the >> one >> that Sally sent across for the HTTP project seemed reasonable. >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> Also, I think that it’s not exactly adherent to the style guide >> >>>>>> and >> that Kenneth plans on putting something together that’s analogous and >> adhere’s to the style guide. >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> Thoughts? -Rob >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>>> On Sep 9, 2019, at 3:17 PM, Gary Gregory <garydgreg...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>>>>>> >> >>>>>>> The KISS solution would be to get "Central" to produce not just >> the Commons >> >>>>>>> logo but one for each component and be done. The even simpler >> >>>>>>> path >> is to >> >>>>>>> forgo component specific logos, especially since Commons is just >> one Apache >> >>>>>>> project. I like simpler... >> >>>>>>> >> >>>>>>> Gary >> >>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>> On Mon, Sep 9, 2019, 15:08 Rob Tompkins <chtom...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> On Sep 9, 2019, at 11:31 AM, Gilles Sadowski < >> gillese...@gmail.com> >> >>>>>>>> wrote: >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> Hi. >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>> Le lun. 9 sept. 2019 à 12:35, Sally Khudairi <s...@apache.org> a >> écrit : >> >>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>> Thank you, Gilles. >> >>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>> I'm copying Kenneth Paskett, creative lead from Central >> Services. I was >> >>>>>>>> talking to him about this opportunity yesterday: we will be >> >>>>>>>> happy >> to >> >>>>>>>> explore options for a future design. >> >>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>> Just curious, who on this transmission is at ApacheCon this >> >>>>>>>> week. >> Having >> >>>>>>>> worked with Sally in the past on an ad-hoc logo for the DC road >> show >> >>>>>>>> earlier this year, I could sit down with her and see if we can >> >>>>>>>> get >> >>>>>>>> something analogous to what we have in place currently that >> satisfies >> >>>>>>>> everyone (granted my designs tend to be minimalist in nature). >> >>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>> Thoughts? >> >>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>> -Rob >> >>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>> I'm not saying "don't use anything that remotely looks like >> >>>>>>>>>> the >> >>>>>>>> feather". It's important that if we choose to use an >> ASF-feather-inspired >> >>>>>>>> motif that it doesn't look like it's a "broken" version of the >> original. >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> It was certainly not the intention. >> >>>>>>>>> It is difficult/impossible to argue on things that boil down >> >>>>>>>>> to a matter of taste or arbitrary policy (like the kinds of >> >>>>>>>>> reuse that are allowed and not by the rights owner). >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>> Ways around that issue could involve the shape or color of the >> feather, >> >>>>>>>> among other adjustments. >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> Exactly what I meant: IMHO those changes are more "broken" >> >>>>>>>>> than a rotation. ;-) >> >>>>>>>>> [But if they are allowed, then fine.] >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>> Thank you and the community for your trust. We look forward to >> working >> >>>>>>>> with you. >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> Hopefully, preferences will be collected in the thread which I >> >>>>>>>>> mentioned in the previous message, and the community can >> >>>>>>>>> converge on a few ideas to help with the design. >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> Best regards, >> >>>>>>>>> Gilles >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>> Best, >> >>>>>>>>>> Sally >> >>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>> - - - >> >>>>>>>>>> Vice President Marketing & Publicity >> >>>>>>>>>> Vice President Sponsor Relations >> >>>>>>>>>> The Apache Software Foundation >> >>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>> Tel +1 617 921 8656 | s...@apache.org >> >>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Sep 9, 2019, at 03:22, Gilles Sadowski wrote: >> >>>>>>>>>>> Hello. >> >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>> Le sam. 7 sept. 2019 à 13:29, Sally Khudairi <s...@apache.org> >> a écrit : >> >>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>> Thank you, Gilles. I appreciate you reaching out. >> >>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>> Normally I encourage PMCs to not re-orient or "spindle" the >> feather >> >>>>>>>> where possible, but I understand that some legacy logos have a >> bit of a >> >>>>>>>> problem with positioning. For example, the Apache HTTP Server >> logo: >> >>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>> - original logo https://twitter.com/apache_httpd/photo >> >>>>>>>>>>>> - interim logo https://britewire.com/apache-http-server/ >> >>>>>>>>>>>> - new logo >> >>>>>>>> >> https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/comdev/project-logos/originals/httpd.svg >> >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> So is the choice between >> >>>>>>>>>>> * use the exact same feather as the foundation's >> >>>>>>>>>>> * not use anything that even remotely looks like feather >> >>>>>>>>>>> ? >> >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>> Whilst I understand the proposed design, I'm not *loving* >> >>>>>>>>>>>> the >> look of >> >>>>>>>> the logo, particularly as Apache Commons has such a massive >> footprint >> >>>>>>>> across so many projects. >> >>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>> To that end, may I ask a favor? >> >>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>> Would you and the Apache Commons PMC be amenable to >> considering >> >>>>>>>> having Central Services --a somewhat new sub-group of ASF >> Marketing & >> >>>>>>>> Publicity-- help you with creating a new logo? >> >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> Help from experts is welcome. >> >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>> If you are not in a rush, we can see how we can help you. >> >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> I don't think we should be in a rush, as the proposal to >> change the >> >>>>>>>>>>> projects' logo(s) dates back from 3 years ago.[1] >> >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>> ApacheCon North America starts on Monday, and we can start >> >>>>>>>>>>>> the >> >>>>>>>> discussions on what your requirements are and the best way to >> meet your >> >>>>>>>> needs. >> >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> I can only speak about of my preferences:[2] >> >>>>>>>>>>> * At most 2 or 3 graphical elements reminiscent of the >> >>>>>>>>>>> project >> >>>>>>>>>>> (feather included, if applicable) >> >>>>>>>>>>> * No URL >> >>>>>>>>>>> * Clearly visible at all (reasonable) resolutions [3] >> >>>>>>>>>>> * Combinable with 1 additional grahical element (so that we >> >>>>>>>>>>> can >> >>>>>>>>>>> easily create one logo for each of the many components hosted >> >>>>>>>>>>> in "Commons" [4] >> >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>> ApacheCon Europe is taking place in October: I was thinking >> the >> >>>>>>>> timeframe between the two events (~6 weeks) would be sufficient >> for us to >> >>>>>>>> have a few proposals developed. >> >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> Great. >> >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>> If this works for you, we can get started this week. >> >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> Fine with me. >> >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>> If not, I understand. You may proceed with the proposed logo >> with the >> >>>>>>>> intention of revisiting and updating in future. >> >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> Now is a good time. >> >>>>>>>>>>> Indeed, that logo is not favoured by the community (at least >> the few >> >>>>>>>>>>> who voiced their opinion).[5] And, IMHO, the alternatives >> >>>>>>>>>>> are >> failing >> >>>>>>>>>>> what I consider basic requirements (cf. above).[6] >> >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>> Many kind thanks again for your attention and consideration. >> >>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>> Warm regards, >> >>>>>>>>>>>> Sally >> >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> Thank you very much for the offer, >> >>>>>>>>>>> Gilles >> >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/COMMONSSITE-86 >> >>>>>>>>>>> [2] Discussion thread: >> >>>>>>>>>>> https://markmail.org/message/twsre7wl6jmue6mp >> >>>>>>>>>>> [3] For example, when I look at the top left of the Apache's >> JIRA >> >>>>>>>> pages: >> >>>>>>>>>>> https://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/Dashboard.jspa >> >>>>>>>>>>> I see either a bad logo, or an inadequate use of it. >> >>>>>>>>>>> [4] See e.g. http://commons.apache.org/proper/commons-rng/ >> >>>>>>>>>>> [5] Lacking feedback, I opted for an upgrade of the feather >> using >> >>>>>>>>>>> the foundation's new graphics keeping the old (and supposedly >> >>>>>>>>>>> consensual) idea for the feather orientation. >> >>>>>>>>>>> [6] Even though it's great that Loic Guibert was willing to >> provide >> >>>>>>>>>>> idea and a few examples. >> >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>> Tel +1 617 921 8656 | s...@apache.org >> >>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Sep 6, 2019, at 17:18, Gilles Sadowski wrote: >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello. >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> We, at Apache Commons, would like to know whether an Apache >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> project is authorized to extract graphical elements from >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> the >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> foundation's logo, apply some transformation to them, and >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> use >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> the result in order to compose its own logo. >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Case in point is here: >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>> >> https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/comdev/project-logos/originals/commons.svg >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> (where the feather has been rotated). >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Does it constitute a breach of the recommendations >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> published >> in >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> the "Identity Style Guide"?[1] >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Thank you, >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Gilles Sadowski >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> [1] >> >>>>>>>> >> https://apache.org/foundation/press/kit/ApacheFoundation_StyleGuide.pdf >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org >> >>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org >> >>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org >> >>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org >> >>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org >> >>> >> >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org >> >>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org >> >>> >> >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org >> >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org >> >> >> > >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org <mailto: >> dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org> >> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org <mailto: >> dev-h...@commons.apache.org> >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
